For the record.

[CasualSax]

The next person that argues with me pointlessly, says you're manipulating me, blah blah, whatever, I'm leaving.  Respect me as a person - I do not enjoy playing a game that makes me angry at other players.  Go ahead and plot, twist things, find loop holes - I don't really mind, it is our nature to find a way to win.  But I've got enough stupid people in my life already with dealing with people like quin.

So go ahead, make me leave.

[quintopia]

I don't know what nerve I have hit with you, but please keep in mind:  this is a game.  I don't want it to affect our relationship in real life.  Just like a board game, or a sport, it should be fun.  It shouldn't be hurtful or cause anything to change outside of this game.

If it really bothers you so much the way this game plays, or you take my style of gameplay personally, perhaps it really is best if you leave.  I honestly don't intend to hurt you in any way, and I respect you in the utmost as a player and an opponent, but I play the only way I know how, and I'd sure hate to lose you because of it.

In fact, I think I can speak for everyone here when I say: We value your input.  Leave if you must, but you will be missed.

[CasualSax]

I'm just saying I don't need to feel this rage inside me.  I have a job, I have an ex-girl - I have enough issues.  I'm a human being - I don't enjoy being overtly "manipulated" - whether it being a simple reverse psychology or not.  Argue the issues, plot with your conspirators.  I think the way I think for a reason - argue the point, not the damned method of voting.

[quintopia]

Don't let this game get to you so, man.  The golden rule here is: Don't get mad, get even.

It's the way it works in any political system:  politicians don't let their business interfere with their lives.

I think the way I think for a reason too, and if arguing the method of voting seems more important than the point to me, I will do what I feel I have to do.

[CasualSax]

Fine.  But I want no part in it.  There are those politicians that are in for developing the best system of fairness, the best for the citizens.  Just consider me one of those.  If I see it is in the best interest of the game itself, I'll accept it.  Otherwise, I won't.

[quintopia]

that's exactly how you should play.  everyone proposes and votes for what they think is in the best interest of the game, myself as well.  All I'm trying to say is: don't take it personally when my opinion doesn't agree with yours.  I listen to what you say; I really do.  But if you decide you won't discuss it at all, then I have no way to understand what it is you want.  It may cause me to say things I wouldn't outside of a game setting.  You can't take that personally either.  If you're willing to play the game with your feelings completely detached, then we can continue with you.

[CasualSax]

I don't take it personally when your opinion disagrees.  What I take personally is you saying things like:

Nemo Praecipuus (10:55:45 PM): wow. it's so easy to get exactly what I want out of you.
CalmBlackPegasus (10:56:40 PM): what's that?
Nemo Praecipuus (10:57:15 PM): the only way we can get this thing passed by you is if you strike it down with no changes
Nemo Praecipuus (10:57:21 PM): thanks for being so stubborn.

I'm a reasonable person.  That is completely uncalled for, and between that and you calling me a liar - well, its gone too far.  I told you quite well what I thought - exactly, and either A. you lied simply to manipulate and tick me the hell off, or you B. weren't truthful at all debating.  No one is 'detached' - you need to use some respect, and not suddenly try and appear calm now that I'm ticked off.

We must balance our right to speak with our responsibility to speak ethically.  Half the people don't talk with each other in this group, and you just abused your right.

I play the game for the game itself.  You play it to set yourself to win.  And thats fine - but when you attack me personally, it goes too far.

[quintopia]

You must be the most ethical and least political Player in this game, seeing your regard for the human being's right to privacy.

You might want to keep in mind the fact that you would end up the dirty one if I allowed this to become a mudslinging match.

[CasualSax]

You forget - I'll be the one leaving, and you'll be the one screwed.  I'm defending your continued attacks and threats on me, once again.  I can defend everything I've said, and your continued plotting is what will screw you over.

And again, by attacking me personally, you wave your right to privacy.  I am not evil - while I have pointed out many proposals and flaws in them, and ways to gain power from them, I have never once acted out on these flaws.  I defend myself by whatever means nescisary - and you would do well to drop this pointless argument, as I have nothing to lose except contact with someone who I now care nothing for.

Attached are *all* conversations I have had with quint regarding nomic.  I suggest taking a look at Sunday's specifically.  As I have said *repeatedly*, I act in the best interest of the game, not in any specific party's.

I now refuse to talk with him over AIM, or anyone else that holds conversations with him.  I will be opposing all legislation that I feel is not in the best interest of the game.  The end.  Anyone who tries to manipulate me, you will follow Quin's fate.

[quintopia]

And I thought you had political reasons for blocking me, airing our dirty laundry on a public forum, and forcing this conflict resolution here.

Ah, well, if you're leaving, I suppose I don't mind this, as I've never said anything I don't mind sharing anyway.

If you're not leaving, then everyone should consider this a warning not to expect any sort of private political discussion with you.  That anything anyone tells you could at any time be shown to the entire world.

[CasualSax]

You should consider the fact that you're the only person who's been able to aggrivate me, since day one.  The fact that you threatened to turn this into a "mudslinging" match made me feel that I must post everything to protect myself.

In fact, since you won't drop this issue and simply appologise WITHOUT continuing to attack me (you calling me to leave, for example), I'd much rather see you leave.  I'm not going anywhere - I said I might leave if this becomes a continued problem, but seeing as you're the problem, I'm not going anywhere.

Anyway, I refuse to continue this childish nonsense.  Leave me alone, and, like I said, stop attacking me.

[quintopia]

1) I tried to apologize in private, but you blocked me.
2) You were the one who made this into a mudslinging match.  I still have not made any personal attacks on you.  I did once call you a liar, but only when I had proof you were lying.
3) You are the one being childish by posting this thread in the first place.  You are making it very hard to play this game.
4) I never called for you to leave.  You wanted to leave, and I said that you should only do so if you feel it absolutely necessary.


If you want to stop this childish nonsense, you'll unblock me and address this issue in a sane, logical, and grown-up manner.  This forum does not need these kind of shenanigans.  This is essentially a legislative body, not a teen drama show.

[tinuviel]

Wow, guys, seriously, chill!  Last time I checked this was a game, in which players are supposed to have fun...and from what I'm seeing here, there is far too much drama and not enough fun.  Thoughts:

- Casualsax, this is a game.  You should not take it seriously enough that it carries over into your personal life and causes you "rage."  It is entirely possible for you to play the game entirely for the sake of the game and no other ulterior motive.  However, don't expect that everyone else thinks the same way.  If you're just playing for the sake of the game, and not to win, then don't get angry when someone else tries to win.
- Quintopia, sarcasm is a virtue best used on those who appreciate it.   :wink:   Trust me.  So perhaps be more sensitive in what you say, there seems to be a lot of misunderstanding going on.  

If you guys are trying to create factions, political parties, or whatever this early on, this is one helluva way to go about it.  I don't know.  I'm new to this game.  But perhaps we should limit our one-on-one off-board discussions, if it's just going to cause animosity.  And if you must, would it be at all possible to just slug it out in person and not drag the entire group into a bitch-fest, please? (: