Random DM nagging.

[Anastasia]

Giving Chameleons access to epic magic doesn't sit right with me. Really goes against the 'jack of all trades master of none' concept in favour of 'it's d&d so why bother with anything but magic'

This, this, this. Basic Chameleon has this problem. The other focuses pale in comparison to arcane and divine focus for utility. The bonuses from them are hyper-eclipsed by what those give. Thinking about that, I'm coming to that conclusion. It's not much more than a mystic theurge in a box with a few extra goodies. It isn't balanced out well enough to support using the other focuses, so you end up stuck in those. To be honest, I couldn't justify Sylvie not using both of them. Arcane makes sense for her, and traveling alone? Healing and clerical magic or a slight damage boost, sneaking or wilderness? Not a hard call.

Meh. I don't really want to start hacking at the base class, but this tempts me.

[Ebiris]

You'd have to hack at all base classes to solve that balance issue.

[Anastasia]

Yeah, I know.

I'm tempted to just ignore epic Chameleon for Sylvie and have her take something else in epic. That doesn't really solve the problems, but it at least minimizes them in practical use.

[Anastasia]

I already nixed this feat, as I feel it's far too situational and too tangential to a battle dancer. Ignoring that aspect for the moment, do you guys think this is useful or too situational/niche/nitpicky? I'm curious since I think it is too niche, but I sort of want to talk myself into it anyway.

Dance of Unrelenting Chaos [Anarchic, Epic]
Prerequisite: Dance of the Furious Unicorn, Celebrant of Chaos, Tumble 24 ranks
Benefit: Your unpredictable style allows you to foil certain types of bonuses against you. You ignore any insight or axiomatic bonuses anyone you target has to armor class or saving throws. Likewise, anyone attacking you loses any insight or axiomatic bonus to attack and damage rolls, as well as any insight or axiomatic bonus to skill rolls or ability checks regarding you.

[Merc]

While axiomatic is certainly super niche (I've never even seen that as a bonus, it's always sacred/profane right?), insight's not bad. It's not common as dodge or enhancement, which would make it very cheesy, but it still pops up somewhat on some classes and spells. I'm not entirely sure it's common enough to qualify as epic though?

[Yuthirin]

Yeah, I know.

I'm tempted to just ignore epic Chameleon for Sylvie and have her take something else in epic. That doesn't really solve the problems, but it at least minimizes them in practical use.

Nothing that I see in the ELH screams Sylvie. You may want to look at a custom class.

[Anastasia]

I'm playing with Sylvie's build path right now. I suspect she'll take straight Factotum on one side, while taking Exemplar and a few other dips on the other side.  She's a jack of all trades, so I'm tempted to have her do a lot of small dips to bolster this.

[Anastasia]

Sylvie is currently level 15

15: Factotum 15//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10 - Feat: Improved Natural Attack(15).
16: Factotum 16//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 1
17: Factotum 17//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 2
18: Factotum 18//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 3 - Feats: Dodge(18), Improved Initiative(E3)
19: Factotum 19//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 3/Human Paragon 1
20: Factotum 20//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 3/Human Paragon 2 - Feat: Mobility(HP2)
21: Factotum 21//Swashbuckler 3/Monk 2/Chameleon 10/Exemplar 3/Human Paragon 3 - Feat:

From there I plan for her to take Arcane Duelist (Cor's suggestion) for two levels, then another few of exemplar, then dip into something else. Spread it around. Edit: She'll need a 1 level arcane dip in there for arcane duelist too, but you get the idea.

[Anastasia]

Willim, do me a favor and break down how your unarmed progression stacks and totals out?

[Yuthirin]

Uhhhh yeah.

I'm a level 12 Monk, which gives me a flat damage die of 2d6. Greater Mighty Wallop at CL 16 grants me four size classes of damage, bringing me to Colossal. This gives me 5d10. My Monk's Belt adds five extra levels onto my unarmed damage, bringing me to 7d10.

So what I'm saying i that my sheet is not correct. It should be 7d10 damage that I'm dealing right now, not 9d10. That's not until later. Woops!

[Merc]

I think you're doing that wrong?

Level 12 puts you at 2d6 like you said. Add 5 levels from the monk belt (level 17 damage) to 2d8. Then refer to page 28 of DMG which has table 2-2 "Increasing weapong damage by size". Four size category increases takes 2d8 to 8d8.

[Yuthirin]

Monk unarmed damage tables for huge and larger creatures. These use the patterns from monk and improved natural attack to extrapolate damage values. Things get crazy at the highest sizes and monk progression. I don't think the formula precisely balances for this level of size and advancement, but I'm not sweating over it, either.



   
   
   
   
   
   
   

Level	Damage (Huge Monk)	Damage (Gargantuan Monk)	Damage (Colossal Monk)
1st-3rd	1d10	1d12	2d12
4th-7th	2d8	2d10	3d10
8th-11th	3d8	3d10	4d10
12th-15th	4d8	4d10	5d10
16th-19th	6d8	6d10	7d10
20th	8d8	8d10	9d10

Using this.

[Merc]

Aaaah, that explains much

[Yuthirin]

Excellent. Damage adjusted on sheet.

[Anastasia]

Okay, duly noted. Will be making a GWP ruling tonight, tomorrow or this weekend. It'll be as soon as I have leisure to run some numbers.