General discussion/opinions

[Carthrat]

Mmm. Temproarily ignoring what people have said (there's too much information!...)

I like the ideas of the party dynamic, here. You've kind of got Seryf and Gavin as different sides of the spectrum; one representing the human world, and one representing elven society, and Saul, Darius and Elaine with their own leanings towards the middle. While we're nominally Team Elf, we could easily pass for Team Human, if we went by words and such alone, I think. We're slowly feeling like more of a *party* as a whole- I think this adventure really highlighted that. I'd love an adventure set apart from the ordeal that played on that; I figure, since we're going back to Paxburg, we'll get an opportunity to do some more urban, talky-interactivity-non-direct-combat adventuring.

Individually...

Gavin: I'm not entirely sure why, but Gavin gives off a good impression of being generally befuddled, and trying to remain a kind of pillar in the group. It's amusing to me! It's true that his knightly status hasn't been played up on much; I think, again, that heading into the city might do something to alleviate that. My biggest gripe is sorta his flippancy so far; on seeing the ordeal, he gives consideration only to if we finish it without regard for the consequences, and his line on the tower ('There's a chance it has not been ransacked yet!") when he knew next to nothing about it made me go o-o;. It's possible that this could be intentional, but he never seemed the overconfident type. Just seems odd to me, overall.

Elaine: I really like Elaine's portrayal. She's young and doubtless the most *excited* member of the group. She's a little naive, too, so Saul feels that he has to watch out for her a little more than everyone else. She's had a chance to shine in general roleplaying but I don't feel she's been able to put her bardic talents to use yet, and we're not emphasizing her 'showy, flashy' method of fighting yet. I figure that if you put a little more extravagant description into your attacks, it would really fit your character. Overall, she actually feels very much like a protagonist. In this adventure, of course, that was Seryf, but if I had to pick a 'main character' out of us, Elaine would be my bet.

Seryf: Inscrutable! Seryf is quite and gives the *impression* of being capable, at least. A few bad rolls is something everyone gets, though. >_>
I thought that his ordeal might give a few more insights into her character; it's shown that she does care about her friends and has a remarkable amount of will. One of my goals is to get her to talk more about herself,  but Saul doesn't want to be too forward because he's not *interested* in elven culture, dammit.

Darius: He's ok, but I think he really needs to play up his barbaric nature a little more. He comes off currently as your sort of typical brash arrogant youth, but there's more to him than that. Remember that he's far from home (a home where he might have felt slightly ostracized, anyway, being a half-elf), and while the rest of us may be familiar with the land, he shouldn't be so comfortable with our customs. I think playing up feelings of being an outsider and his whole barbaric beast-tamer nature could go well. As for Serith, outside comabt, at least, his relationship with her is spot on.

Myself: I'm having a blast playing Saul.. outside of combat. I kinda see him as the most jaded and most worldly member of the group; I want to give more expositions and generally play up being a smart guy who always knows what's going on. I'd *also*, however, like to remind everyone that he's basically a good guy, though one with some moral ambiguity, as shown by the dragon, and the ordeal just now. I've been unlucky on the healing and with that whole almost-killing-Darius thing, but I also hope to make him seem like he's looking out for the group overall, more.

Combat.

Hmm. The problem with combat, as I see it, is that we have three fighters, a fighting bard, and a single mage. It seems that most people are out to do the same thing- close in melee and mangle people. It's true that I'm not getting a chance to show much flashy magic beyond sleep and ye olde healing spell, but I honestly expected that at this point in the game.

I think two main things need to be done in combat to clear things up.

1) Differentiate the fighters from each other. This shouldn't be that hard. It's mostly a matter of description. Since nobody decided to be an archer (damn dual-wielders) we need to focus on melee, and I don't actually think that should be that hard. You've got Gavin, the stoic tank guy, ideally placing himself between all attacks and the rest of the group; Seryf, brutal elf grl, now armed with some pretty potent magical swords, who can quickly move around and kill important targets.

Darius, who relies on Serith to give him combat awesome. I think it might not be a bad idea to have them act on the same initiative count, or provide some tangible bonus when they're working together to take someone down. It might not even be a + to hit- maybe something like a chance to knock an opponent down whenever they both hit him in a round, or something. As I said earlier, Elaine needs to focus on her extravagant style. She should *look*, as is my understanding, like the most dangerous opponent on the battlefield. Buy a bandana, a ragged cloak, and cast Cantrip or Light to increase the idea that you're a *BADASS SWORDSMASTER*, even though it's obviously not true. ^^

Myself, two things would improve my combat play. The first is levelling more and obtaining access to certain magic items- more scrolls, or wands. That's a blatant plug that I'll get in time, anyway, so never mind that.

The second is the environment itself. When I'm not casting a spell, it's almost useless for me to just attack in melee, so what I'd rather do is run around the area looking to do things that benefit our group, like, I dunno. If we're fighting in a dungeon, closing gates to make sure reinforcements don't arrive. Overturning barrels of oil and throwing them at people. Pulling open curtains and throwing them over enemies. That sort of thing- my most hated battle, at the moment, would be one in a flat, featureless plain, while my most entertaining would be in a place where there's lots of *stuff* to do.

[Dracos]

THe whole 'lots of stuff to do' in a battle scene is neat.  I'm keen with that...

But at the same time, I would warn against Dune trying so hard that battle bogs down in it.  It's one thing if we're fighting in an already described area.  It's another if someone is looking around to see things they could do while orcs are bearing down on us.

Dracos

[Anastasia]

I like the ideas of the party dynamic, here. You've kind of got Seryf and Gavin as different sides of the spectrum; one representing the human world, and one representing elven society, and Saul, Darius and Elaine with their own leanings towards the middle. While we're nominally Team Elf, we could easily pass for Team Human, if we went by words and such alone, I think. We're slowly feeling like more of a *party* as a whole- I think this adventure really highlighted that. I'd love an adventure set apart from the ordeal that played on that; I figure, since we're going back to Paxburg, we'll get an opportunity to do some more urban, talky-interactivity-non-direct-combat adventuring.

This part of your reply grabs me the most. Care to elaborate a little; this interests me greatly.

[Carthrat]

Which part? =p

The whole racial thing could play an important role, if you wanted it to, see. The only true 'representatives' of the races are, as I said, Gavin and Seryf. Elaine, Saul and Darius should probably all not feel like they totally fit in (perhaps Elaine less so), due to their upbringings and their own race. Saul's been humanized a fair bit, Elaine has lived in a human city all her life, and Darius is a barbarian with weird customs anyway, so, while we're all technically elvish to a dgree, we could be argued to act more like humans than elves.

Because we represent a spectrum as a group, you could start playing on that by introducing, say, social circles only certain members can easily move through. Seryf could easily interact with elven outposts and the like, while Gavin moves around human nobility easily. Darius has got his tribe, wherever that is, Saul has a whole freaking temple on-side, and Elaine is the prime choice for dealing with the middle-class tavern-goers and the like. We've all got.. hmm, our own *environment* in which we'd be most comfortable, and that could be nice to use, too.

That said, though, *initial* reactions to group aren't likely to recognize this. I can see plenty of people jumping to the wrong conlcusion regarding, say, myself or Darius (we represent opposite ends of civility and barbarity, too! Hoohah!) and the like. Hmm.

[Anastasia]

THe whole 'lots of stuff to do' in a battle scene is neat.  I'm keen with that...

But at the same time, I would warn against Dune trying so hard that battle bogs down in it.  It's one thing if we're fighting in an already described area.  It's another if someone is looking around to see things they could do while orcs are bearing down on us.

Dracos

This depends on what Rat has in mind with this, really. Rat?

[Anastasia]

Which part? =p

The whole racial thing could play an important role, if you wanted it to, see. The only true 'representatives' of the races are, as I said, Gavin and Seryf. Elaine, Saul and Darius should probably all not feel like they totally fit in (perhaps Elaine less so), due to their upbringings and their own race. Saul's been humanized a fair bit, Elaine has lived in a human city all her life, and Darius is a barbarian with weird customs anyway, so, while we're all technically elvish to a dgree, we could be argued to act more like humans than elves.

Because we represent a spectrum as a group, you could start playing on that by introducing, say, social circles only certain members can easily move through. Seryf could easily interact with elven outposts and the like, while Gavin moves around human nobility easily. Darius has got his tribe, wherever that is, Saul has a whole freaking temple on-side, and Elaine is the prime choice for dealing with the middle-class tavern-goers and the like. We've all got.. hmm, our own *environment* in which we'd be most comfortable, and that could be nice to use, too.

That said, though, *initial* reactions to group aren't likely to recognize this. I can see plenty of people jumping to the wrong conlcusion regarding, say, myself or Darius (we represent opposite ends of civility and barbarity, too! Hoohah!) and the like. Hmm.

Mmm.

Heh, heh, heh. Now this I like - it's excellent DM mind food, and has given me several ideas already. I like how you portrayed this, Rat, it works on a very nice level. Some of it's obvious, but it's a very neat way to present it in a group-wise fashion.

[Carthrat]

That depends on the environment, really. It actually works better in urban and indoor environments, where there's chandeliers to cut down, bookcases to push over, and the like. Levers to pull, doors to close.. generally, I'll think of *something*, except in open areas like where we fought the troll, or closed but bland areas where we fought the other troll.

Pushing rocks down hills is good, too!

[Anastasia]

That depends on the environment, really. It actually works better in urban and indoor environments, where there's chandeliers to cut down, bookcases to push over, and the like. Levers to pull, doors to close.. generally, I'll think of *something*, except in open areas like where we fought the troll, or closed but bland areas where we fought the other troll.

Pushing rocks down hills is good, too!

I'm surprised you didn't try to knock of the troll off the dais altogether. It was fairly high up as I noted in Seryf's description of it, but I suspect no one paid attention or didn't think to.

But mmm. Yeah, inside, that's more viable. As long as it doesn't get too complicated, anyway, since having to worry if every single room has x number of windows or potted plants does get bothersome.

[Asrana]

Like Rat, the massive hogshead of information here is a little too intimidating to really touch on, so...random thoughts off the port bow~!

As far as characters...Gavin,m yeah, I've seena s out of his element at the moment with our whole 'deep in elven culture' part. Otherwise though, I have to agree that he's doing a great job as the party shield and pillar of moral virtue. Mmmm...from my perspective, Seryf has wanted to nudge a little closer to him, I started out with the vague impression of them being an older set of friends like Saul and Elaine, and I think it's worked out okay-ish, mostly due to lack of opportunity (most of the time I get to really interact closely with Gavin is while he's half carrying me from a battlefield >_>). Overall he does come off as a sort of young knight, who ahsn't quite entirely grown into his authority and proess, but is still advancing.

Elaine...yes, we all love El-chan. She's fun to be around, energetic, exuberant, passio-wait, wait, wrong list. *Coughs* Anyway, yeah, she's great to be around, and by her level ups it looks like she'll begin to move into the damage dealer section a bit (like she's moved into every section), where big sis' Seryf will welcome her! I can't really say much that hasn't been said...just that there's never a dull or unfun moment while RPing with her.

Saul, hmmm...I guess I feel some connection with us both being full elves, even if we share very little culturally, that's likely Seryf's isolation from elven culture (relatively speaking, she's the least isolated, but she's still somewhat isolated!). From my POV, he's also the more vocal pragmatic, and perhaps more cynically pragmatic than Seryf. Overall, I like his drive, he definitely seems like a person with Goals, and his obsessive pursuing of magic books is both amusing and interesting. Combat wise and magery wise, yeah, we haven't seen much of him. Hmm...I guess I see him less of as a cleric or mage, and more of a mystically inclined thinker.

Darius...I do have to agree he hasn't come out as shining anywhere in particular, and I was a touch surprised at just how much Serith took to me initially. I think he could use a good few social development sessions, or more time working with animals.Overall yeah, a bit of a 'little brother' feeling, though not by much at all, maybe just a little more awakward.

Overall, I'm liking it, I like my place in it (which I'll address in another post where I gather quotes and pick you all apart! Mwaha! >_>), and I'm liking everyone else, and life is good, and I have SHINIES.

[Anastasia]

Darius...I do have to agree he hasn't come out as shining anywhere in particular, and I was a touch surprised at just how much Serith took to me initially. I think he could use a good few social development sessions, or more time working with animals.Overall yeah, a bit of a 'little brother' feeling, though not by much at all, maybe just a little more awakward.

I like this idea and I approve of it. That sort of session strikes me as a good idea for all three concerned, and probably ties into Serith. Mmm, Serith...mmm.

I've been working with her. At first I played her as rather laid back and subtle, but I got asked to make her more visible. So I have, but she's become almost independant of Iddy - we do PM back and forth a fair bit IC, but it doesn't appear that way often. (It's how Iddy knew how to react just before the portal to Seryf opened.)

I'm certainly open to connecting the two more, but it's problematic to coordinate Serith and Darius every single moment when I'm running other NPCs and a scene. Darius, would you be interested with more of Serith's reactions or duties?

[Dracos]

I'd really poke that it may just be better to have Iddy run both characters during fights and stuff.

Coordination on that scale is stalling.

Dracos

[Asrana]

Seryf...well, she said it outright IC, she's never been the most nature orientedof rangers. She was trained protecting caravans and around mostly human towns...and she took a primary interest in swordplay. That said, I don't think there have been a huge number of opportunities for it, either. She crit failed the one tracking attempt, but she did manage to locate the path to...um...Corela's town! We haven't really gotten too involved with animals outside those bears, and as they were mind controlled...eh, the best she could do was quick deaths.

Mmmm. That said, I agree she is much more of a nature oriented swordswoman than a sword inclined nature person. I wouldn't entirely mind a shift in the direction of fighter, I guess, as itmakes a lot of sense for her as a character if nothing erupts to drag her back into the greeny deep. Hmm...straight up fighter just really didn't suit in my mind, she has a love for her swords, and a skilled practice with bows, but...she's always been a sort of mobile/specialized/individualist person than the sorta 'medieval martial artist' that fighters come across as.


Now on to her social life!
I think she's setlting a bit into this 'big sister' thing, being one of the oldest of them all, as well as maybe a quieter and more stable person at the same time. And yeah, I admit she has a fairly 'Hotaru' tendency, but I'm engulfed in Hotaru most of the week, and they talk to each other a lot! ...Okay, honestly? It goes with her personality, they share the base of 'quiet weapony type with some oddball ulterior interests and a vaguely pragmatic POV', so a lot of the time they feel and act similarily.

Probably more time than necessary spent on that point. >_>

As for Rat speaking about her development here...mmm, I think you'd be surprised by how little elven culture came up if you did, Rat. I've eben trying to play her a lot more 'human' than a mystical and enigmatic elf, as she's spent a lot of her time in the human world, but keeping some of the more slow approach to things. I personally can't consider her a pinnacle of elven culture, though in relation to the party, I guess she is. >_>

As far as playing her? It's been fun, and getting more so. I like where she's gone and how she's developed, even if I haven't quite developed her as a personality IC as much as I'd like to. She also does her job very, very well, what with the spinning blades of death and what not.In a combat sense, it's very fun to play her, diving in headfirst with blood and so such...and yeah, her weakness individually got highlighted very pointedly last adventure.

Hmm. On a random note, you could try getting her tipsy, Saul! =P

I probably rambled more than I should've, but I like talking about me!

[Iron Dragoon]

I wouldn't mind just flat out taking control of her during combat.. I just didn't want to have control of her as a character simply because it'd be too easy to fall into the trap of using her as a tool to get the RP stuff I want done without having to really work at it =\

I wanted her to be an actual character instead of just a puppet I can make act a certain way to make a situation the way I want it, ya know?

[Carthrat]

Mmm, more Serith is fun for everyone. She seems like she'd have wildly different reactions to the group members, honestly; she could be really close to Darius, obviously, but still to a degree with Seryf (I pronounce their names the same! @_@). I'd like to see how she acts around us other three sometimes.

Well.

Not me.

For a few weeks.

>_>

[Dracos]

eh...

I'd rather less or the same Serith and more interaction between each other.  Yes, I know not directly contradictory, but I'd rather see dune focusing more on providing opportunities (not saying he hasn't been) for party interaction more.  I like Serith sticking mainly to Darius as a partner relation/interaction most the time as it builds Darius' character when that happens.  As I said, I feel a lot of the effort to spread Serith out among the party has come at a cost of Darius feeling like a lesser character than Serith.  Which is wrong.

Additionally, when interacting with the tiger, that tends to take center stage, thus we're not, as a party, filling those spots with our characters being a party.  We're paying attention to the tiger and usually the one or two people the tiger is bouncing around.  Not a bad thing there, but the main reason I wouldn't want to see it take more prominance.

Dracos