Heads up -- if you've not read the original, this one gets pretty grim in places. Outright squicky in others.
Be advised.
This is my first go at a rewrite to try and smooth over some parts that seemed rough in retrospect, and expand on the ending a bit. There's now an added epilogue, which I like, but falls squarely into 'implausibly optimistic' for others, I expect. If you don't like it, pretend it's not canon to the story. >_>
Hello. This is my first time trying heavy C&C, but hopefully it'll help nonetheless.
Here's what I've found for Act I:
QuoteThat thought felt like it kick-started his heart
The thought isn't feeling anything.
QuoteItsuki's normal smile faded slightly. "I find it a comforting thought....
I'd go with 'I find that a comforting thought'
Quote[size=78%]"[/size]I am simply stressed, and pressing you too closely;....
I forget what this error is called, but that comma shouldn't be there. It deprives 'pressing' of a subject.
Quote[size=78%]"....[/size][size=78%]The bonds of trust between us all are solid, and I should not test them so. I apologize."[/size]
I'm not entirely sure how much I agree with this statement. Of course, if it's disputable, then Koizumi would know how disputable it is... I'm not sure on this one.
I'm not entirely sure about the last actual paragraph of that scene. It seems rather out of character for Kyon. There may be a difference based on viewpoint, but it still seems rather strange, not even in that he's telling Koizumi his plan as much as in how he's telling him.
Also in said paragraph is the following.
QuoteIf even the normally unflappable Itsuki were so shaken.
This is a fragment, and the even seems to be misplaced.
QuoteKyon went to his shoe-locker, freezing at the sight of a decorated envelope awaiting him.
This implies that the envelope is outside of the shoe locker (which I don't believe needs a hyphen).
Mikuru's request seems a bit OoC as well. I don't think she'd ask Kyon to skip class and leave school like that; I think she'd be more likely to meet with him somewhere in the school. The clubroom would probably work, especially considering Nagato's absence. After reading further in, this opinion is shaken a bit, but the clubroom would still be able to function.
Quote"You have his measure, then?"
Wait, what?
Actually, the setup for this part seems a little forced. I don't think Koizumi would be almost late, and I'm pretty sure Haruhi's almost always early.
Quotebut I'd like to think that it might ... shed some light when Kyon-kun feels surrounded by darkness.
Why the lapse into 3rd person? It seems rather out of place, especially when there's a second person pronoun earlier in the sentence.
Asakura's actions seem to be a bit out of line. I think that at this point she'd be a little more concerned with Kuyoh and the Sky Canopy Dominion, although I may be wrong.
Also, how would killing Kyon render her autonomous?
QuoteHaruhi was asleep in his bed, exhausted by everything Itsuki had told her -- everything that had happened.
Koizumi's bed, I assume? The his is a bit ambiguous.
Quote"The responsibility of explaining Nagato Yuki's circumstances fall to you;
It should be 'The responsibility ... falls to you.'
Right. I apologize if I'm being condescending or anything with the grammar corrections or anything.
Welcome to the boards, Gotonis. Just a heads up, it makes things easier in back and forth if you keep the tag count low. Otherwise things can tend to bleed when folks are quote responding back to you.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMHello. This is my first time trying heavy C&C, but hopefully it'll help nonetheless.
Oh, hello. I don't ... think we've met? :)
Welcome to the forums!
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMHere's what I've found for Act I:
Excellent -- thanks for taking the time. :D
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMThe thought isn't feeling anything.
I actually don't see a problem with this one -- but if it scans poorly, it's easily revised.
Quote from: revisionHis heart felt like it was kick-started by that thought. Roused from his sour mood slightly, he shook his head and took a deep breath.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuote[size=78%]"[/size]I am simply stressed, and pressing you too closely;....
I forget what this error is called, but that comma shouldn't be there. It deprives 'pressing' of a subject.
Extraneous comma, reflexive comma, or just uneccessary.
However -- this is spoken dialog, which doesn't have to be grammatically perfect. For Koizumi you'd expect it to be, but that's all aside. It indicates a conversational pause.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuote[size=78%]"....[/size][size=78%]The bonds of trust between us all are solid, and I should not test them so. I apologize."[/size]
I'm not entirely sure how much I agree with this statement. Of course, if it's disputable, then Koizumi would know how disputable it is... I'm not sure on this one.
It's somewhat iffy -- Koizumi is playing it up because he's fishing for information. He's effectively manipulating Kyon (quite well, too).
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMI'm not entirely sure about the last actual paragraph of that scene. It seems rather out of character for Kyon. There may be a difference based on viewpoint, but it still seems rather strange, not even in that he's telling Koizumi his plan as much as in how he's telling him.
Out of character for Kyon to trust Koizumi? Debatable -- but Koizumi's being manipulative, and even if Kyon doesn't typically
like Koizumi, at that point in the novels, he does trust him.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMAlso in said paragraph is the following.
QuoteIf even the normally unflappable Itsuki were so shaken.
This is a fragment, and the even seems to be misplaced.
Huh ... not sure how I missed that. o_O?
Quote from: revisionIf even the normally unflappable Itsuki were so shaken by recent events....
This is meant to be the line that implies Kyon is sharing the secret because he thinks Koizumi's uncertain and wants assurance (as Koizumi basically states earlier in that scene).
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuoteKyon went to his shoe-locker, freezing at the sight of a decorated envelope awaiting him.
This implies that the envelope is outside of the shoe locker (which I don't believe needs a hyphen).
Actually, what you infer and what I imply are different. Very slightly. :p
But I clarified:
Quote from: revisionNot wanting to speak with him, Kyon went to his shoe locker and opened it, freezing at the sight of a decorated envelope awaiting him.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMMikuru's request seems a bit OoC as well. I don't think she'd ask Kyon to skip class and leave school like that; I think she'd be more likely to meet with him somewhere in the school. The clubroom would probably work, especially considering Nagato's absence. After reading further in, this opinion is shaken a bit, but the clubroom would still be able to function.
No, the clubroom wouldn't work for this. I can't see Haruhi running away from Mikuru and Kyon, there, and it would be much harder for her to spy on them and see the critical exchange later.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuote"You have his measure, then?"
Wait, what?
Somewhat outdated idiom. Effectively in this context, Koizumi's being a bit smug and asking, "You know what he's up to?"
If it doesn't work for anyone else, I can easily revise that.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMActually, the setup for this part seems a little forced. I don't think Koizumi would be almost late, and I'm pretty sure Haruhi's almost always early.
To the first, Koizumi wasn't late, he was waiting. Keep in mind that (as mentioned later in this chapter), he's got time travelers working with him, too, so there's a certain amount of foreknowledge.
To the second, this is from novel 10 (maybe 9 or 11) -- Haruhi comes to school barely before the bell because she was checking on Yuki. I guess I can mention that in the narration, but I feel it'd slow things down; I like the streamlines storytellign style for this one.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuotebut I'd like to think that it might ... shed some light when Kyon-kun feels surrounded by darkness.
Why the lapse into 3rd person? It seems rather out of place, especially when there's a second person pronoun earlier in the sentence.
A combination of trying for 'cute' factor, and also to emphasize Mikuru's nervousness. I think I've done this elsewhere, too. (From a technical standpoint, that's how it would be in Japanese -- doing it constantly, eeeh.... But once in a while, I think works. Again, if there are other complaints, I can fix it.)
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMAsakura's actions seem to be a bit out of line. I think that at this point she'd be a little more concerned with Kuyoh and the Sky Canopy Dominion, although I may be wrong.
Kimidori lampshades this later -- Ryouko was unstable, and this was a good opportunity to get rid of her.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMAlso, how would killing Kyon render her autonomous?
I couldn't figure that one out, myself. She still tells Kyon she wants to try it in novel 10, though! We may never get an answer.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuoteHaruhi was asleep in his bed, exhausted by everything Itsuki had told her -- everything that had happened.
Koizumi's bed, I assume? The his is a bit ambiguous.
Swapped his name with the 'his,' then.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMQuote"The responsibility of explaining Nagato Yuki's circumstances fall to you;
It should be 'The responsibility ... falls to you.'
Oops!
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 02:02:16 AMRight. I apologize if I'm being condescending or anything with the grammar corrections or anything.
Thanks for the feedback. I'd comment in more detail myself, but I am unreasonably exhausted -- so -- thanks for taking the time, and again, welcome to the forums. :)
Trying to do like with the
Insight thread. Summarizing things helps me keep my place and see how things fit together.
Act 1:
We start with the brigade preparing to leave Nagato's apartment. Kyon ruminates on how, if he absolutely had to, he could use the trump card to save Nagato, but he concludes there are still other options on the table. Koizumi approaches him, and Kyon expresses confidence. Koizumi offers him a ride, which Kyon accepts.
Quote"May I know what reassures you so suddenly?" the esper prompted, dropping his mask for a rare moment to show a genuinely hopeful smile as the vehicle lurched into motion.
Perhaps "May I ask..."?
Kyon begins to think that he can't solve this on his own, that he needs the others' support to make any real headway against the kinds of problems they face. I think this is a justified thought process, considering how helpless he feels during the canonical scene in Nagato's apartment. It might stand some more reinforcement that this (or something else, if I've misjudged) is part of what's led him to think this way.
QuoteKyon almost laughed, managing a nod, feeling that -- for once -- the esper had shown enough of his true face that he could be honest. If even the normally unflappable Itsuki were so shaken. He sighed, leaning closer than he would have liked to the other boy to whisper, "Okay...." Arakawa obligingly turned on the radio, filling the front with noise as Kyon explained what his trump card actually was.
The "If even..." does seem like it should be connected to a full sentence in some way.
Overall through this section, Koizumi does come off as non-threatening, almost enough that I can believe Kyon would feel enough at ease to confide in him. I say
almost because it strikes me as odd that Kyon would need to disclose the fine details of what exactly his trump card is to assure Koizumi that all can be managed. Can he not say, "I have a trump card; I can convince Haruhi that she has powers and to trust me implicitly; the details aren't important," and leave it at that?
I say this because I know without this point, Koizumi doesn't get to put his own plan in motion, so it seems like some mention of how Koizumi manages to pull this particular detail out of him (but not, pointedly, that John Smith called out to Haruhi after they were finished) might be needed.
It could be you did address this point later, and I simply do not recall.
Kyon finds a letter in his shoe locker at school.
QuoteSo, please! Meet me at Kitaguchi station at 9:30 AM! If you agree, it's very important that you not let Suzumiya-san see you!
Should it be Station?
QuoteThat thought in mind, he took a breath to steel himself, then raced out the school's western exit, going a roundabout way to avoid crossing paths with her as he pushed himself, tearing down the hill toward the nearer Kuyouen station.
Definitely Kouyouen.
Haruhi muses on how sitting behind Kyon is reassuring.
QuoteHaruhi didn't want to admit it, but now that Yuki was sick, sitting in the boring classroom behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium. Her only real consolation was the fact that he was just as upset about circumstances as she was -- that was the only thing that kept her from screaming in frustration about the entire state of affairs.
Emphasis mine; I think one of these two
onlys might be best removed.
QuoteHe was the one she could vent her complaints about concerning Yuki's condition and ... somehow ... it felt like he had a deeper understanding of the situation than he pretended. He ignored her bluster about making Yuki better, while still encouraging her to do her best ... as though he believed she could effect a positive change no matter what she did.
Maybe just "about"?
Haruhi catches sight of Kyon leaving the grounds and follows him, eventually with Koizumi as well. When Koizumi remarks how he's "eternally at her side," Haruhi has a thought:
QuoteShe huffed at that and nodded, looking away. Itsuki wasn't like....
Itsuki wasn't like Kyon, in the way that he would show her such overt loyalty?
QuoteHeart pounding, a sour expression on his face, Kyon reached Kitaguchi station, leaving his bike in the storage locker for the moment and scanning around for Mikuru's older self.
Earlier, Haruhi say Kyon jogging down the street, but now he has to worry about his bike? It seems unlikely, even for Haruhi, that she could keep up with him if he's on his bike.
Kyon makes it to the station and, curiously, finds the younger Asahina there, who invites him to coffee.
QuoteOnce their server had taken their orders and vanished through the doorway, Mikuru took a deep breath. "O...okay. Um ... as ... you know, there are usually certain, important restrictions about ... what and when can be said," she began carefully.
Perhaps "about what can be said and when"?
QuoteHe sighed, running a hand through his hair. Missing a day of school was going to cause him trouble, especially with that recent poor exam result. Still ... it was Mikuru, so he couldn't really say he felt upset by it, if he was confused. It was silent for a moment, while he tried to understand her motivations. At the same time, her expression slowly changed to dawning understanding.
Perhaps "
even if he was confused"? "Understand" and "understanding," and I find the last sentence puzzling. Asahina is only beginning to realize the intentions behind her orders here? Is that what this should mean?
Asahina sidles up to Kyon.
Haruhi and Koizumi follow Kyon on the train.
QuoteWith Itsuki at her side, they managed to scurry to one side of the ugly hedge surrounding the stupid cafe that Mikuru had led Kyon to.... What was Mikuru up to, anyway? Haruhi wanted to be mad at Kyon for doing something this moronic, but he'd been dressed for school, and Mikuru hadn't. Had she then ... called him here?
Not sure what to do about one of these
sides.
Haruhi sees Asahina kiss Kyon, and she reels from this. Koizumi is there to support her, both physically as she loses her balance and emotionally, and then he says there's something she hasn't realized.
QuoteDrawing himself full upright, almost striking a pose, he gave her a very solemn, almost familiar look ... as though.... "Haruhi," he said, unexpectedly -- Unwelcomely! -- familiar, causing a jolt though the tangled emotions she still hadn't sorted out.
Repetition again.
Kyon is stunned at the kiss and wonders if Asahina might be a fake like before, but her shaken reaction to him convinces him she's real. Asakura appears behind him somewhat suddenly.
Quote"I'll explain~!" she offered, syrupy sweet, the knife remaining held perfectly stationary, even as she herself shifted around to move into-- He closed his eyes. He had that much control over himself, at least.
Asakura is still behind him (?) yet somehow he perceives the knife as staying still?
Asakura makes it known that Kyon is no longer important, so the Entity has decided that terminating him is no big deal.
Cut to Haruhi asleep in bed, while Kimidori and Koizumi have a conversation.
Quote"The responsibility of explaining Nagato Yuki's circumstances fall to you; our half of the bargain is complete."
Falls.
QuoteEven the time travelers had acknowledged that it was a predetermined event, though. Without their help, he thought it might have been impossible.
This puzzled me. It seems clear that the time travelers would need to be involved to get Asahina to instigate what happened, yet why she would do that...well, saying it's merely predetermined does
cover it, I suppose. Nevertheless, if I remember this correctly, it does raise questions about how Asahina (big) could give orders from the future if...well, come to think of it, I think I remember you addressed that, too, though the exact reasoning escapes me.
Things to learn from this story: Koizumi is a sneaky bastard. Getting Kyon's trump card out of him without knowing how it could benefit him, then using it so devilishly, allying with the Entity and the time-travelers to eliminate all obstacles and frighten Haruhi with her own temper is pretty slick.
Will try to get to the other acts as I can.
Only a single correction that popped out at me:
QuoteMikuru had less than me and was even wobblier on her feed
"feed" -> "feet"
"You have his measure, then?" worked for me. Apparently I'm old-fashioned enough to get it. (Off the top of my head, I picture it in a setting like Sherlock Holmes)
As for the changes to act 3 and the epilogue, I can see it going either way. In the former version, Kyon and Mikuru had 3 years together w/o Haruhi. It also, to me, comes across as "even if things become alright, there are still long term consequences". In this new revision, it feels more like Kyon is typically dense and Mikuru is her normal shy self. Of the two, I would pick the latter only because it adds more to the story. As for act 3 w/o the epilogue... I would say it feels like a good ending that's left open. So, that may or may not be what's desired.
thanks for the comments -- am feeling under the weather at the moment, so will reply properly later
QuoteOh, hello. I don't ... think we've met? :)
Welcome to the forums!
No, I don't believe we have, or at least in the forums. You may have read one of the reviews I wrote for In Your Dreams on ff.net, but otherwise no.
Quoteit makes things easier in back and forth if you keep the tag count low.
Oops. I honestly don't know how those got there. I think it was a matter of my switching b/w word and this caused formatting errors when I tried to fix the font. Thanks for the heads up.
But on to reviewing
QuoteOut of character for Kyon to trust Koizumi? Debatable -- but Koizumi's being manipulative, and even if Kyon doesn't typically like Koizumi, at that point in the novels, he does trust him.
I didn't have as much of an issue with telling him as much as the way he was telling him/the way you presented it.
I forgot about Haruhi's lateness at that point. never mind on that one.
Now, onward to Act II.
Ok, why is it starting in first person? Was that habit or on purpose?
QuoteLosing my self-control had cost me three people I'd known as friends, once.
That comma seems misplaced. I can conceive of it being there for emphasis or something, but I don't think it's the case this time.
QuoteI wouldn't let it happen again.
I think this would be considered an error in tense. I mean, past/present indicative is allowable, but past indicative to that would form? I'd go with 'I refuse to let/allow it to happen again.' Won't/shan't could work, but refuse seems to convey the determination in the statement better.
QuoteWith Itsuki's help, I was ... still upset,....
I don't know about this one. It almost seems like Koizumi's keeping her on the upset side.
Also, I don't think Haruhi has ever called him anything other than Koizumi-kun.
That entire paragraph seems questionable, but it's also understandable considering how upset she is.
QuoteUnless they needed my help after all.
Again, I could be wrong, but this seems to be a tense error. I'd go back and look for those, I'm seeing quite a few questionable verb tense uses.
Hmm... Reading a little further in, I see that the two of them seem to be dating. In that case, I would put less weight on the suggestion to call him 'Koizumi-kun'; maybe 'Itsuki-kun'? I don't know, it seems a little weird to have her calling him 'Itsuki' straight up.
I'd do the same with 'Hayate' vs. 'Hayate-kun'. I mean, I know Haruhi's rather forward with suffixes in going to -chan almost immediately, but I don't think she just drops titles like that. I'd consider the possibility of skipping them in narration, but Kyon still gives Asahina a -san, so...
QuoteIn Hayate's room, he was already at his desk....
This seems a bit out of order, but it's your call.I think the 'he' makes it read funny, but at the same time it's necessary to kill word rep.
For the record, I think the rest of that scene was executed pretty well.
The next scene, you lapse into a past tense, so you have a past describing a past-er, even though the primary time is more of a present.
...
Kyon plotting to have Haruhi killed?
Something is wrong with that statement. What did she DO?
QuoteThat kind of person couldn't...I hardly did
Again, more referring to the present stuff in past tense. I mean, I understand if it's a stylistic thing, but it seems more inconsistent.
QuoteWhat had killed Yuki for trying to interfere while she was injured.
It's a fragment, but in the thought stream it should be fine. I'm just wondering if this is intended in this case.
QuoteI could hear myself, demanding, whiny ...
I'd use a colon after myself.
Oh hey, the next scene switches back to third person. You do both well, but there's a little bit of a jolt in the transition, especially when you're looking for that kind of thing.
QuoteShe found a new joy...
I'm thinking 'she had found a new joy' would work better.
QuoteShe was sitting on the large sofa, ... but completely absorbed in her book.
I think that the ellipsis makes it a little clearer that but isn't the best conjunction to use there.
QuoteHer fingertips traced... on a picture of her and Kyon together
I'd take the on out. The subsequent 'him looking... slightly less annoyed....' seems like it could be worded a bit better. I'd either add a with or go with 'a picture of her and Kyon together in which he looked....', or something along those lines.
I love how Koizumi distrusts Kyon because he didn't tell him something he hadn't thought necessary for Koizumi to know. It's a good small detail to throw in; it just makes him so much easier to hate.
Wait, why is Haruhi doing to herself what she did to Kyon? wouldn't it have been more productive to just undo it? Never mind.
Good job with that chapter. Sorry for going so grammar intensive, especially considering how much of it could just be stylistic.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMTrying to do like with the Insight thread. Summarizing things helps me keep my place and see how things fit together.
Heh -- this story isn't nearly as complex. :p
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuote"May I know what reassures you so suddenly?" the esper prompted, dropping his mask for a rare moment to show a genuinely hopeful smile as the vehicle lurched into motion.
Perhaps "May I ask..."?
Makes sense.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMKyon begins to think that he can't solve this on his own, that he needs the others' support to make any real headway against the kinds of problems they face. I think this is a justified thought process, considering how helpless he feels during the canonical scene in Nagato's apartment. It might stand some more reinforcement that this (or something else, if I've misjudged) is part of what's led him to think this way.
Hmm. I can develop that a bit more, sure.
Quote from: revisionReally ... it was the others who accomplished everything. When Yuki had changed the world and charged him with fixing it, he'd stumbled -- it had fallen to _her_ to save him. Was he, maybe ... a little too confident in his thoughts that he could forge ahead with Haruhi without any other help?
Visiting Yuki with the others while she was sick and being as powerless as he had been was a firm reminder of that fact. There really was nothing he could do, on his own.
At the same time ... that was something that only he and Haruhi knew. A true secret. Not that ... he thought.... Well, with Haruhi....
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMThe "If even..." does seem like it should be connected to a full sentence in some way.
I haven't posted an updated version, but that's already been fixed. >_>;
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMOverall through this section, Koizumi does come off as non-threatening, almost enough that I can believe Kyon would feel enough at ease to confide in him. I say almost because it strikes me as odd that Kyon would need to disclose the fine details of what exactly his trump card is to assure Koizumi that all can be managed. Can he not say, "I have a trump card; I can convince Haruhi that she has powers and to trust me implicitly; the details aren't important," and leave it at that?
I say this because I know without this point, Koizumi doesn't get to put his own plan in motion, so it seems like some mention of how Koizumi manages to pull this particular detail out of him (but not, pointedly, that John Smith called out to Haruhi after they were finished) might be needed.
It could be you did address this point later, and I simply do not recall.
No, I don't really explore it later in this act. It's not stated, and I guess I could extend the scene a bit at the cost of subtlety -- Kyon doesn't just offer the details up, Koizumi asks for them.
...actually. That would probably fit well in a revision of act two, better than here. Well, no, that doesn't answer the question as to 'why' if it's not plausible here. I guess I do have to extend the scene.
My precious minimalism!
Quote from: revisionKyon almost laughed, managing a nod, feeling that -- for once -- the esper had shown enough of his true face that he could be honest. If even the normally unflappable Itsuki were so shaken by recent events.... He sighed, leaning closer than he would have liked to the other boy to whisper, "Okay...." Arakawa obligingly turned on the radio, filling the front with noise.
"In a worst cast situation," Kyon explained, "I have a trump card to convince Haruhi of her powers -- I know if we have to, I can use that, and she can help us."
The esper's eyes widened in surprise. "Is that ... so? I don't understand -- what is it? How would it work?"
Kyon shifted his shoulders again, realizing that it _would_ be a difficult thing for the other boy to accept at face value. "Alright," Kyon said with a sigh. "So, last year's Tanabata, with Asahina-san's help...."
The esper smiled with visible relief, listening eagerly.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMKyon finds a letter in his shoe locker at school.
QuoteSo, please! Meet me at Kitaguchi station at 9:30 AM! If you agree, it's very important that you not let Suzumiya-san see you!
Should it be Station?
I ... think you're right.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMDefinitely Kouyouen.
Oops. >_<
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteHaruhi didn't want to admit it, but now that Yuki was sick, sitting in the boring classroom behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium. Her only real consolation was the fact that he was just as upset about circumstances as she was -- that was the only thing that kept her from screaming in frustration about the entire state of affairs.
Emphasis mine; I think one of these two onlys might be best removed.
Hmmm. Kind of stymied on replacements -- just omitting either doesn't really work. Ah -- just replace 'her only real' with 'the greatest.'
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteHe was the one she could vent her complaints about concerning Yuki's condition and ... somehow ... it felt like he had a deeper understanding of the situation than he pretended. He ignored her bluster about making Yuki better, while still encouraging her to do her best ... as though he believed she could effect a positive change no matter what she did.
Maybe just "about"?
Ah, yeah.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMHaruhi catches sight of Kyon leaving the grounds and follows him, eventually with Koizumi as well. When Koizumi remarks how he's "eternally at her side," Haruhi has a thought:
QuoteShe huffed at that and nodded, looking away. Itsuki wasn't like....
Itsuki wasn't like Kyon, in the way that he would show her such overt loyalty?
Hm. Kind of a little double-meaning; Haruhi's also noting that she doesn't think of Koizumi 'that way.' I think this one's alright as it is.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteHeart pounding, a sour expression on his face, Kyon reached Kitaguchi station, leaving his bike in the storage locker for the moment and scanning around for Mikuru's older self.
Earlier, Haruhi say Kyon jogging down the street, but now he has to worry about his bike? It seems unlikely, even for Haruhi, that she could keep up with him if he's on his bike.
Er, no-- Kyon rides his bike to school, and walks up the hill. Tanigawa doesn't explain where he leaves the bike ... but it's probably at Kitaguchi station, since bringing a bike onto a train is a bit of a hassle (though doable). Instead of grabbing the bike, which he may not use, he elects to leave it in the locker. Still -- the detail adds nothing, so I'll drop it.
...reclaiming a tiny piece of my precious minimalism. :p
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteOnce their server had taken their orders and vanished through the doorway, Mikuru took a deep breath. "O...okay. Um ... as ... you know, there are usually certain, important restrictions about ... what and when can be said," she began carefully.
Perhaps "about what can be said and when"?
That sounds good.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteHe sighed, running a hand through his hair. Missing a day of school was going to cause him trouble, especially with that recent poor exam result. Still ... it was Mikuru, so he couldn't really say he felt upset by it, if he was confused. It was silent for a moment, while he tried to understand her motivations. At the same time, her expression slowly changed to dawning understanding.
Perhaps "even if he was confused"? "Understand" and "understanding," and I find the last sentence puzzling. Asahina is only beginning to realize the intentions behind her orders here? Is that what this should mean?
Aha-- Fixed:
Quote from: revisionHe sighed, running a hand through his hair. Missing a day of school was going to cause him trouble, especially with that recent poor exam result. Still ... it was Mikuru, so he couldn't really say he felt upset by it, even if he was confused. It was silent for a moment, while he tried to understand her motivations. At the same time, her expression slowly changed to firm resolve.
Haruhi and Koizumi follow Kyon on the train.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteWith Itsuki at her side, they managed to scurry to one side of the ugly hedge surrounding the stupid cafe that Mikuru had led Kyon to.... What was Mikuru up to, anyway? Haruhi wanted to be mad at Kyon for doing something this moronic, but he'd been dressed for school, and Mikuru hadn't. Had she then ... called him here?
Not sure what to do about one of these sides.
For the second, I think I can just say they run up to the base of the hedge -- it surrounds the outdoor portion of the cafe anyway.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteDrawing himself full upright, almost striking a pose, he gave her a very solemn, almost familiar look ... as though.... "Haruhi," he said, unexpectedly -- Unwelcomely! -- familiar, causing a jolt though the tangled emotions she still hadn't sorted out.
Repetition again.
Ugh. Every single instance of repetition you pointed out, I was already aware of, and wasn't able to think of an alternative. Well, I had a lot of time, since the initial issues, so fixed the others.
This one, I'm stuck on. The second instance could be 'casual', but that doesn't feel it captures things right -- because it is not in any way a casual moment.
So -- I'll just drop the 'almost familiar' clause.
I feel it loses something, but I can't figure out an alternative. :\
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMAsakura is still behind him (?) yet somehow he perceives the knife as staying still?
It hasn't moved away or gone through his throat, so logically, yes, it's still. O_o? I don't understand what the confusion you're having is, here. Maybe that she's mentioned as staying still? I can add him feeling her moving behind him -- shifting her feet, or something like that.
...no, that's actually in the same paragraph already.
Sorry, Muphrid, I can't understand what the issue here is.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMQuoteEven the time travelers had acknowledged that it was a predetermined event, though. Without their help, he thought it might have been impossible.
This puzzled me. It seems clear that the time travelers would need to be involved to get Asahina to instigate what happened, yet why she would do that...well, saying it's merely predetermined does cover it, I suppose. Nevertheless, if I remember this correctly, it does raise questions about how Asahina (big) could give orders from the future if...well, come to think of it, I think I remember you addressed that, too, though the exact reasoning escapes me.
I like to think that Mikuru wouldn't have knowingly helped with this part, personally. But there are other time travelers. Beyond that, yeah, preserving the time-steam.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMThings to learn from this story: Koizumi is a sneaky bastard. Getting Kyon's trump card out of him without knowing how it could benefit him, then using it so devilishly, allying with the Entity and the time-travelers to eliminate all obstacles and frighten Haruhi with her own temper is pretty slick.
Hmm.... Thinking about that, I've decided to revise that bit at the end of the first scene further:
Quote from: revision"In a worst cast situation," Kyon explained, "I have a trump card to convince Haruhi of her powers -- I mentioned it when I told you about traveling to that other world, last December."
The esper nodded, looking as uncertain as he had before. "You never explained the mechanism of that before. If ... if something were to happen to you, maybe it would be better for someone else to be able to deliver the message to Suzumiya-san?"
Kyon shifted his shoulders again. He couldn't imagine Itsuki using it frivolously -- and as helpless as he often was, someone else being able to play that card....
"Okay," he said, nodding. The esper smiled with visible relief, listening eagerly.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 02, 2012, 01:57:50 PMWill try to get to the other acts as I can.
No rush -- thanks for the reply. :)
QuoteIt hasn't moved away or gone through his throat, so logically, yes, it's still. O_o? I don't understand what the confusion you're having is, here. Maybe that she's mentioned as staying still? I can add him feeling her moving behind him -- shifting her feet, or something like that.
...no, that's actually in the same paragraph already.
Sorry, Muphrid, I can't understand what the issue here is.
I think I understand now, though the scene still gives the impression that Asakura is holding the knife behind him while moving into view (at least, before Kyon can close his eyes). It seems...contorted, but then, that could add to the creepiness factor. The simpler motion, in my mind, would be if the knife circled him while she was.
Hooray for cheating and reviewing off the revised Markdown. =P
QuoteThe one who might have been inflicting this upon Yuki.
Sentence fragment. The structure is fine, just make the preceding ellipsis a pause and don't capitalize this phrase.
Quotehe remembered what he said he'd do if he had to, if Yuki was in danger once.
I'd move the 'once' to before the comma. As phrased it's a little awkward.
Quote"A pleasant thought?" the esper prompted ...
Minor note, but this is the first reference to Koizumi in the fic overall. Granted, it is fanfiction and we should be familiar with the players involved, but I'd normally expect to see a name reference first rather than a description - those would come later.
Quoterealizing he'd almost forgotten Itsuki's presence somehow
Understandable since he gets the more familiar 'Itsuki' from Haruhi for a big chunk of the fic, but seeing it used here is slightly odd, since this is more Kyon's PoV. Continues to occur throughout, from what I'm seeing. It should certainly be the rule as of Act II, but giving him that familiarity this early seems off to me.
QuoteI am simply stressed, and pressing you too closely;
Comma is unnecessary here.
Quote"In a worst cast situation," Kyon explained,
Worst case.
Quotesitting in the boring classroom behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium.
These are... sort of but not exactly contradictory sentences. Lessons are 'one of the more reassuring parts of her day', which sounds good, but they're also 'sheer tedium', which sounds painful. Maybe something with a slightly less negative connotation, like she can take her mind off the hook and not think about much of -anything- while she's dealing with class, etc.
Quotescanning around for Mikuru's older self
Should either be 'scanning' or 'looking around' - scanning already implies that he's not just looking in one place.
Quotediscussing an un-liked manager
Should just be 'disliked', maybe 'mutually disliked'.
Quotewithout being spotted was tricker than Haruhi had expected
Trickier.
Quoteunexpectedly -- Unwelcomely! -- familiar
Unwelcomely does not need capitalization here, even if you're using it as an interjection, since it'd indicate the end of the enclosing sentence. You'd need another complete sentence afterward. (I think, this is kind of a gray dialogue-like area. Still would say don't capitalize though.)
Quotepull down the front of her sun dress
Sundress should just be one word - no space, no hyphen. Think you had a hyphenated version a bit earlier:
Quotea pink sun-dress with a wide-brimmed straw hat
Quoteoverlaid with a washed out yellow tone
washed-out
QuoteHe dare not speak, just catching a hint of her sleeve, still clad in her uniform from the corner of his eye, the edge of her hand -- the handle of the blade.
Tense. Should be 'dared not'.
Also, the entire sentence is a bit awkwardly structured; 'still clad in her uniform from the corner of his eye' seems really run-on and confusing. I think this might work better if broken into two sentences, although I can see using sentence fragments for dramatic effect here if that works better for you.
The knife holding stationary works fine for me, although if it doesn't kill your minimalism you might want to play up how smooth her movements are even while the knife remains perfectly immobile - highlights how unnatural she is, not that she needs the help. =P
Quoteat least as far as Nagato Yuki, you know.
I'd suggest 'as far as Nagato Yuki has'.
Quotemore from my own curiosity
Suggest 'more
for my own curiosity'.
Quoteit was a predetermined event, though.
From a fellow sufferer: LYNCH THE THOUGH! After Muphrid's commentary earlier I've been kind of hypersensitive to places where they really don't add much, and this seems like one of them.
Quote from: JonBob on March 02, 2012, 02:20:09 PMOnly a single correction that popped out at me:
QuoteMikuru had less than me and was even wobblier on her feed
"feed" -> "feet"
Aces -- thanks for the catch. :)
Quote from: JonBob on March 02, 2012, 02:20:09 PM"You have his measure, then?" worked for me. Apparently I'm old-fashioned enough to get it. (Off the top of my head, I picture it in a setting like Sherlock Holmes)
As for the changes to act 3 and the epilogue, I can see it going either way. In the former version, Kyon and Mikuru had 3 years together w/o Haruhi. It also, to me, comes across as "even if things become alright, there are still long term consequences". In this new revision, it feels more like Kyon is typically dense and Mikuru is her normal shy self. Of the two, I would pick the latter only because it adds more to the story. As for act 3 w/o the epilogue... I would say it feels like a good ending that's left open. So, that may or may not be what's desired.
Okay -- Act 3 working with or without the epilogue is my goal. I know some (a lot) of people don't like that whole angle, so making it optional seemed like a very good fit -- people who don't like it ... can ignore it!
(Also, in general, tried to be fairer to Haruhi -- that's why there's no 'almost attacks Kyon's sister' part anymore. >_>; But if she's better, she also deserves better, and so....)
Thanks for the feedback. :)
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMHooray for cheating and reviewing off the revised Markdown. =P
You rascally youkai. :D
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuoteThe one who might have been inflicting this upon Yuki.
Sentence fragment. The structure is fine, just make the preceding ellipsis a pause and don't capitalize this phrase.
Lisa: "Sentence fragment" is
also a sentence fragment.
Linguo: *shifty eyes* Shutting down to conserve battery.
Alright. That was stylistic, but easily fixed.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuotehe remembered what he said he'd do if he had to, if Yuki was in danger once.
I'd move the 'once' to before the comma. As phrased it's a little awkward.
Done. As per usual, if I don't respond to a comment, it's because I used it.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuote"A pleasant thought?" the esper prompted ...
Minor note, but this is the first reference to Koizumi in the fic overall. Granted, it is fanfiction and we should be familiar with the players involved, but I'd normally expect to see a name reference first rather than a description - those would come later.
Hmm. I had a lot of stylistic elements like that in the story. I guess the rest have been culled, so this should go, too.
Pity, I kind of liked the style....
I changed it to 'a voice,' since Koizumi is introed in the next line.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuoterealizing he'd almost forgotten Itsuki's presence somehow
Understandable since he gets the more familiar 'Itsuki' from Haruhi for a big chunk of the fic, but seeing it used here is slightly odd, since this is more Kyon's PoV. Continues to occur throughout, from what I'm seeing. It should certainly be the rule as of Act II, but giving him that familiarity this early seems off to me.
When compared to every Haruhi fic written (or even just the ones I wrote), this is true -- but it's consistent throughout the fic. Yuki is also 'Yuki' instead of 'Nagato', and Mikuru is always 'Mikuru' instead of 'Asahina-san'. While it is third person limited ... eh-- If I do make this change, then for Kyon's PoV, Yuki has to become Nagato, Mikuru has to become Asahina-san, and I also have to adjust Haruhi's PoV to make Koizumi 'Koizumi-kun', and if I'm feeling particularly spiteful, Kyon in Koizumi's PoV becomes 'the loser' or 'the fool', or something like that.
I can do it, but -- considering all that, should I?
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuotesitting in the boring classroom behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium.
These are... sort of but not exactly contradictory sentences. Lessons are 'one of the more reassuring parts of her day', which sounds good, but they're also 'sheer tedium', which sounds painful. Maybe something with a slightly less negative connotation, like she can take her mind off the hook and not think about much of -anything- while she's dealing with class, etc.
Uh, no, not the subtext I was aiming for. She couldn't care less about classes, but likes the fact that Kyon's there. Kyon is the good, school is the bad.
Suggestions?
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuotediscussing an un-liked manager
Should just be 'disliked', maybe 'mutually disliked'.
Mutually disliked sounds good.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuoteunexpectedly -- Unwelcomely! -- familiar
Unwelcomely does not need capitalization here, even if you're using it as an interjection, since it'd indicate the end of the enclosing sentence. You'd need another complete sentence afterward. (I think, this is kind of a gray dialogue-like area. Still would say don't capitalize though.)
In that case, I also have to drop the exclamation point. Will italicise to reclaim lost impact.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMAlso, the entire sentence is a bit awkwardly structured; 'still clad in her uniform from the corner of his eye' seems really run-on and confusing. I think this might work better if broken into two sentences, although I can see using sentence fragments for dramatic effect here if that works better for you.
Hmmm. Technically, her sleeve is her clothing, not part of her (to be wearing something).
Quote from: revisionHe dared not speak, just catching a hint of her uniform sleeve from the corner of his eye. Beyond that, he could see the edge of her hand -- the handle of the blade.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMThe knife holding stationary works fine for me, although if it doesn't kill your minimalism you might want to play up how smooth her movements are even while the knife remains perfectly immobile - highlights how unnatural she is, not that she needs the help. =P
I'd rather just leave it as is, if that works. @_@
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 03:42:52 PMQuoteit was a predetermined event, though.
From a fellow sufferer: LYNCH THE THOUGH! After Muphrid's commentary earlier I've been kind of hypersensitive to places where they really don't add much, and this seems like one of them.
Good catch -- dropped. As always, thanks for the comments, Hal; much appreciated. :)
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 07:18:37 PM
Alright. That was stylistic, but easily fixed.
If it's stylistic, it's fine just to say so and leave it unchanged. Just because I'm pointing it out doesn't -require- that it be corrected, just that I'm pointing out something that's technically not correct. If there's a good reason for leaving it as is, go for it.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 07:18:37 PM
Hmm. I had a lot of stylistic elements like that in the story. I guess the rest have been culled, so this should go, too.
Pity, I kind of liked the style....
I changed it to 'a voice,' since Koizumi is introed in the next line.
Well, the intent isn't to kill the style, necessarily, it's more that everyone else is name-dropped first, then the descriptors diverge. Koizumi just caught my eye since he wasn't - and if that's intentional, to make him stand out from everyone else, by all means leave it in. It's not a major fault, just something that caught my eye as slightly odd. Perhaps that was your intent!
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 07:18:37 PM
When compared to every Haruhi fic written (or even just the ones I wrote), this is true -- but it's consistent throughout the fic. Yuki is also 'Yuki' instead of 'Nagato', and Mikuru is always 'Mikuru' instead of 'Asahina-san'. While it is third person limited ... eh-- If I do make this change, then for Kyon's PoV, Yuki has to become Nagato, Mikuru has to become Asahina-san, and I also have to adjust Haruhi's PoV to make Koizumi 'Koizumi-kun', and if I'm feeling particularly spiteful, Kyon in Koizumi's PoV becomes 'the loser' or 'the fool', or something like that.
I can do it, but -- considering all that, should I?
Your call there - to echo previous commentary here, I'm just pointing out things that look strange or odd. If they're strange or odd by design, that's fine.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 07:18:37 PM
Uh, no, not the subtext I was aiming for. She couldn't care less about classes, but likes the fact that Kyon's there. Kyon is the good, school is the bad.
Suggestions?
I'd suggest bridging her relief at having Kyon present into the first sentence. The tone seems to take a somewhat positive note with the whole 'reassuring' angle, then the next sentence kind of drops that positive tone on its face, and we don't get a pick-up (and a kind of half-hearted one) until she continues on to talk about being reassured by Kyon directly. The half-hearted return is okay - it's a sucky situation, so there's not a ton to be positive about - but I think what's causing the dissonance is that it seems to say 'Stuff is not so bad! The same stuff blows. But it's manageable because Kyon is there!' The sudden change in tone with a full stop is kind of like hitting a wall and stopping dead, at least in my mind.
Or perhaps I'm just heavily overanalyzing. @_@
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMNo, I don't believe we have, or at least in the forums. You may have read one of the reviews I wrote for In Your Dreams on ff.net, but otherwise no.
Well -- nice to meet you. Especially thanks for the feedback! Do you have any stories of your own you'll be sharing with us?
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteit makes things easier in back and forth if you keep the tag count low.
Oops. I honestly don't know how those got there. I think it was a matter of my switching b/w word and this caused formatting errors when I tried to fix the font. Thanks for the heads up.
Yeah, if you can, set Word to 'plain text' -- you've got something that converts word into htm and then from there into bbcode, I think; tons of 'font' and 'size' tags.... Curious. You can probably accomplish this just by saving a single file as plain text (not rich text), and then using that one file as a scratchpad for your replies.
I use notepad++ myself, but I think Word gives you a better output if you're uploading to ff.net (barring the use of Markdown or the like).
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteOut of character for Kyon to trust Koizumi? Debatable -- but Koizumi's being manipulative, and even if Kyon doesn't typically like Koizumi, at that point in the novels, he does trust him.
I didn't have as much of an issue with telling him as much as the way he was telling him/the way you presented it.
I revised it a little, to show how that whole thing worked out -- hopefully this helps address some of those spots where it felt unnatural.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMNow, onward to Act II.
Ok, why is it starting in first person? Was that habit or on purpose?
On purpose for a few reasons. One of them is that unlike the first chapter, there's a primary PoV character. The other is that this was pre-Sympathy, when I was trying to develop a first-person 'voice' for Haruhi, so this was somewhat experimental, and largely an excuse to try and write her in first person.
I think it was ... mostly successful, though after everything that she's gone through by the start of Act II, pretty divergent from canon.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteLosing my self-control had cost me three people I'd known as friends, once.
That comma seems misplaced. I can conceive of it being there for emphasis or something, but I don't think it's the case this time.
Revised to drop the 'once' and start the sentence with, "At one point,".
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteI wouldn't let it happen again.
I think this would be considered an error in tense. I mean, past/present indicative is allowable, but past indicative to that would form? I'd go with 'I refuse to let/allow it to happen again.' Won't/shan't could work, but refuse seems to convey the determination in the statement better.
I'm not sure about this one. I think it's okay as it is, because it should be past-tense -- your suggestions all veer toward making it present tense, which may be grammatically correct (though I'm not convinced it is). Even if it
is correct, it jars to me by making tenses inconsistent, and consistency trumps correctness.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteUnless they needed my help after all.
Again, I could be wrong, but this seems to be a tense error. I'd go back and look for those, I'm seeing quite a few questionable verb tense uses.
No? It should all be consistently past tense. You seem to think it's something else. Could be a miscommunication here?
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMHmm... Reading a little further in, I see that the two of them seem to be dating. In that case, I would put less weight on the suggestion to call him 'Koizumi-kun'; maybe 'Itsuki-kun'? I don't know, it seems a little weird to have her calling him 'Itsuki' straight up.
It's actually supposed to feel a bit weird -- the relationship isn't quite ... right ... and using a name for Koizumi that's correct and also goes against fan convention is a handy tool to use that. Though, going back to Hal's remark -- making his name 'Koizumi' in Act I may actually help
hilight this, so that adds some real temptation to do so.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMI'd do the same with 'Hayate' vs. 'Hayate-kun'. I mean, I know Haruhi's rather forward with suffixes in going to -chan almost immediately, but I don't think she just drops titles like that. I'd consider the possibility of skipping them in narration, but Kyon still gives Asahina a -san, so...
Well, the '-chan' thing is actually intentional disrespect from Haruhi toward Mikuru -- refusing to aknowledge her 'senior' status. <_<;
Anyway -- should be consistent, so made it '-kun' throughout.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMThe next scene, you lapse into a past tense, so you have a past describing a past-er, even though the primary time is more of a present.
...no, no it's not. It's all past tense. I'm kind of baffled as to what makes you think it's not. O_o?
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteThat kind of person couldn't...I hardly did
Again, more referring to the present stuff in past tense. I mean, I understand if it's a stylistic thing, but it seems more inconsistent.
Uh -- okay, wow. Sorry, I'm going to have to ignore your comments WRT tenses, no offense.
There's a pretty big cognitive disconnect here. I'm looking at the line you highlighted, and all I can see is that (maybe) you think anything that's not perfect past, isn't past at all.
So, yeah, call it stylism.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteI could hear myself, demanding, whiny ...
I'd use a colon after myself.
Alright, that looks good.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMOh hey, the next scene switches back to third person. You do both well, but there's a little bit of a jolt in the transition, especially when you're looking for that kind of thing.
Yeah, the jarring is intentional -- it's a severe PoV shift.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteShe found a new joy...
I'm thinking 'she had found a new joy' would work better.
Looks good.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteShe was sitting on the large sofa, ... but completely absorbed in her book.
I think that the ellipsis makes it a little clearer that but isn't the best conjunction to use there.
Just omitted the clause in the middle since it wasn't adding much.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteHer fingertips traced... on a picture of her and Kyon together
I'd take the on out. The subsequent 'him looking... slightly less annoyed....' seems like it could be worded a bit better. I'd either add a with or go with 'a picture of her and Kyon together in which he looked....', or something along those lines.
I can't understand what you're trying to say here. I changed 'on' to 'over' since it was a bit stiff.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMGood job with that chapter. Sorry for going so grammar intensive, especially considering how much of it could just be stylistic.
It's fine; I couldn't use all of your comments, but still appreciate that you took the time to make them. :)
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 07:51:11 PMIf it's stylistic, it's fine just to say so and leave it unchanged. Just because I'm pointing it out doesn't -require- that it be corrected, just that I'm pointing out something that's technically not correct. If there's a good reason for leaving it as is, go for it.
Yeah, but this bit of stylism was mostly cleared out already because it didn't seem to be widely accepted. I use it also in
Our Inevitable Fate, and it seems to work better there. Then again, the fact that different characters (there) use different names for one-another can make it hard to read ... but Cobb didn't like it, and that just encourages me to keep it because, really?
Screw Cobb and his 'Haruhi is more interesting as a lovecraftian horror' approach to things. :p
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 07:51:11 PMWell, the intent isn't to kill the style, necessarily, it's more that everyone else is name-dropped first, then the descriptors diverge. Koizumi just caught my eye since he wasn't - and if that's intentional, to make him stand out from everyone else, by all means leave it in. It's not a major fault, just something that caught my eye as slightly odd. Perhaps that was your intent!
Yeah, but stylism isn't good when it makes the story impenetrable.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 07:51:11 PMYour call there - to echo previous commentary here, I'm just pointing out things that look strange or odd. If they're strange or odd by design, that's fine.
Okay -- I'll revise Act I to use custom names instead of consistent ones. (Well, they'll be consistent per character, I guess.) Makes the jarring 'Itsuki' in Act II more pronounced.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 03, 2012, 07:51:11 PMQuote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 07:18:37 PMUh, no, not the subtext I was aiming for. She couldn't care less about classes, but likes the fact that Kyon's there. Kyon is the good, school is the bad.
Suggestions?
I'd suggest bridging her relief at having Kyon present into the first sentence. The tone seems to take a somewhat positive note with the whole 'reassuring' angle, then the next sentence kind of drops that positive tone on its face, and we don't get a pick-up (and a kind of half-hearted one) until she continues on to talk about being reassured by Kyon directly. The half-hearted return is okay - it's a sucky situation, so there's not a ton to be positive about - but I think what's causing the dissonance is that it seems to say 'Stuff is not so bad! The same stuff blows. But it's manageable because Kyon is there!' The sudden change in tone with a full stop is kind of like hitting a wall and stopping dead, at least in my mind.
Or perhaps I'm just heavily overanalyzing. @_@
Well, I'll take a look at that after I fix the names.
Actually, no. Because Koizumi thinking of himself as 'Koizumi' instead of by his given name ... hmm. Well.... On third thought, that actually
does hammer home the 'mask' aspect. How creepily fitting. o_o
Anyway. Didn't go with honorifics, since to me they jar in third person. Yuki is Nagato, except in Haruhi's PoV, and Mikuru is Asahina, except in Haruhi's PoV. Koizumi is Koizumi across the board. For extra creep/sees-her-as-not-a-human-factor, in Koizumi's PoV sequence, Haruhi is Suzumiya. (Huh, I just realized this means that even Kyon thinks of himself as Kyon. Hm.)
Now, to revise that awkward bridge....
Quote from: revisionHaruhi didn't want to admit it, but now that Yuki was sick, sitting behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium; she couldn't care less for the lessons. The real consolation was the fact that he was just as upset about circumstances as she was -- that was the only thing that kept her from screaming in frustration about the entire state of affairs. Seeing him struggling to deal with the tedium while distracted by concern for Yuki made Haruhi feel less alone.
There we go. That better?
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:36:22 PM
Yeah, but stylism isn't good when it makes the story impenetrable.
True, but the particular point in question here (leading off with a reference to Koizumi as 'esper') isn't really that - again, this is fanfiction, we know the players in the game. =P Leading him off as 'a voice' works, though.
Part of it is that leaving him just as 'the esper' kind of highlights his distance from the rest of the group, which is why I both point it out as sticking out and don't really push that hard to kill it. =P
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:36:22 PM
Okay -- I'll revise Act I to use custom names instead of consistent ones. (Well, they'll be consistent per character, I guess.) Makes the jarring 'Itsuki' in Act II more pronounced.
That was a part of why it seemed like a better call that way. I do think it'll have a good effect on the impact of Act II.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:36:22 PM
Now, to revise that awkward bridge....
Quote from: revisionHaruhi didn't want to admit it, but now that Yuki was sick, sitting behind Kyon was actually one of the more reassuring parts of her day. She could still focus on and get through her lessons, but it was sheer tedium; she couldn't care less for the lessons. The real consolation was the fact that he was just as upset about circumstances as she was -- that was the only thing that kept her from screaming in frustration about the entire state of affairs. Seeing him struggling to deal with the tedium while distracted by concern for Yuki made Haruhi feel less alone.
There we go. That better?
Looks fine. Got a repetition of 'lessons' in there, though, and I might alter slightly to 'she couldn't care less for the lessons/(lectures) themselves', since that helps to extend the hook that it's something else that makes the day Okay.
Alrighty -- fixed the repetition as per your suggestion. Thanks, Hal! :)
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PM
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMNo, I don't believe we have, or at least in the forums. You may have read one of the reviews I wrote for In Your Dreams on ff.net, but otherwise no.
Well -- nice to meet you. Especially thanks for the feedback! Do you have any stories of your own you'll be sharing with us?
Actually, that's why I came here. An anonymous reviewer on ff.net pointed me here after helping me with a prologue I had posted and in response to my fishing for betas.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PM
Yeah, if you can, set Word to 'plain text' -- you've got something that converts word into htm and then from there into bbcode, I think; tons of 'font' and 'size' tags.... Curious. You can probably accomplish this just by saving a single file as plain text (not rich text), and then using that one file as a scratchpad for your replies.
I use notepad++ myself, but I think Word gives you a better output if you're uploading to ff.net (barring the use of Markdown or the like).
I just decided to ignore Word for replies and post as plain text for quotes from the original text.
Also, I'm not sure what the disconnect was with the tenses. I think I subconsciously convert narration to present. I also have been known to switch between past and present frequently; interpret that as you will.
By the way, I see what you were doing with PoVs. You pulled it off rather well, it just seemed rather odd.
I figured I'd make some really bad corrections. I'm actually happy about this; I think C&Cing is going to be rather helpful in pointing out my weaknesses and stylistic fallacies.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PM
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMQuoteHer fingertips traced... on a picture of her and Kyon together
I'd take the on out. The subsequent 'him looking... slightly less annoyed....' seems like it could be worded a bit better. I'd either add a with or go with 'a picture of her and Kyon together in which he looked....', or something along those lines.
I can't understand what you're trying to say here. I changed 'on' to 'over' since it was a bit stiff.
Right.
I was trying to say a couple of things. 'Traced on' seemed a bit redundant. Also,
QuoteOn a picture of her and Kyon together, him looking...slightly less annoyed
is grammatically incorrect. I'd go with 'a picture of her and Kyon together in which he looked slightly less annoyed...'
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PM
Quote from: Gotonis on March 02, 2012, 10:42:45 PMGood job with that chapter. Sorry for going so grammar intensive, especially considering how much of it could just be stylistic.
It's fine; I couldn't use all of your comments, but still appreciate that you took the time to make them. :)
Yeah, sorry about all of the incorrect comments. As I believe I said before, I'm new at this, and my past vs present could use some work, to say the least. I'll be rereading the other two acts for corrections to post so I can justify posting my story.
By the way, is it considered bad form here to make extensive quotation tunnels?
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 01:55:05 AMActually, that's why I came here. An anonymous reviewer on ff.net pointed me here after helping me with a prologue I had posted and in response to my fishing for betas.
Will be looking forward to that, then.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 01:55:05 AMAlso, I'm not sure what the disconnect was with the tenses. I think I subconsciously convert narration to present. I also have been known to switch between past and present frequently; interpret that as you will.
Okay, noted. Not really a problem. One of the things I really like about C&Cing on a forum or with a community is the fact that if a correction is wrong, someone else will usually catch it, and ideally, everyone can benefit from the explanation.
Like so:
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 01:55:05 AMI figured I'd make some really bad corrections. I'm actually happy about this; I think C&Cing is going to be rather helpful in pointing out my weaknesses and stylistic fallacies.
:)
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 01:55:05 AMI was trying to say a couple of things. 'Traced on' seemed a bit redundant. Also,
QuoteOn a picture of her and Kyon together, him looking...slightly less annoyed
is grammatically incorrect. I'd go with 'a picture of her and Kyon together in which he looked slightly less annoyed...'
Oh, I see. Will fix that, then.
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PMYeah, sorry about all of the incorrect comments. As I believe I said before, I'm new at this, and my past vs present could use some work, to say the least. I'll be rereading the other two acts for corrections to post so I can justify posting my story.
While appreciated, there's no rule about having to comment before you can post your own stories. :)
Quote from: Brian on March 03, 2012, 08:20:11 PMBy the way, is it considered bad form here to make extensive quotation tunnels?
Not really ... we're pretty relaxed in general. As long as it's not hard to reply to, then it should be fine.
Haven't had much of a chance to actually provide in depth grammatical corrections for anything, sorry about that.
Did notice one thing in the epilogue:
QuoteNote: Gentle reader, you may enojy or ignore this small performance, as you see fit. :)
Some personal thoughts are that I enjoyed the extended ending feeling of it, I think that for me at least the epilogue added some content to the final section that I felt was somewhat lacking in the original iteration.
One thing that's more up in the air for me at least, is:
The fate of one Koizumi Itsuki. I notice that in this case you make it clear that he did get out of the situation that Haruhi left him in, while in the original version you more or less left him to his fate. I realize that his treatment might be one of the more divisive things about this fiction, but personally -- and I do mean personally here -- I was happy enough to see the bastard burn. He essentially took the confidence of his friends, and then used it to usurp a position of power AND eliminate them from the plot at the same time.
I know that you've mentioned that you've been particularly hard on Itsuki, and since I know where the root of that comes from (you know that which must not be named) I find it understandable, if a little unfair in some cases. But I just feel that the Koizumi here has done something so utterly reprehensible that him getting out of the situation just seems well, wrong. I know that he hasn't been forgiven by any stretch, and I know that Haruhi feels bad about what she did which speaks more to her development as a character than to the idea that he somehow didn't earn exactly what she gave him.
I dunno, maybe I'm just more spiteful than I'd really like to admit, but that's my view on it anyway.
Quote from: Grahf on March 04, 2012, 04:49:25 AMHaven't had much of a chance to actually provide in depth grammatical corrections for anything, sorry about that.
Did notice one thing in the epilogue:
QuoteNote: Gentle reader, you may enojy or ignore this small performance, as you see fit. :)
My spelling is just going downhill these days. No idea what's going on with that. >_<
Quote from: Grahf on March 04, 2012, 04:49:25 AMSome personal thoughts are that I enjoyed the extended ending feeling of it, I think that for me at least the epilogue added some content to the final section that I felt was somewhat lacking in the original iteration.
One thing that's more up in the air for me at least, is:
The fate of one Koizumi Itsuki. I notice that in this case you make it clear that he did get out of the situation that Haruhi left him in, while in the original version you more or less left him to his fate. I realize that his treatment might be one of the more divisive things about this fiction, but personally -- and I do mean personally here -- I was happy enough to see the bastard burn. He essentially took the confidence of his friends, and then used it to usurp a position of power AND eliminate them from the plot at the same time.
I know that you've mentioned that you've been particularly hard on Itsuki, and since I know where the root of that comes from (you know that which must not be named) I find it understandable, if a little unfair in some cases. But I just feel that the Koizumi here has done something so utterly reprehensible that him getting out of the situation just seems well, wrong. I know that he hasn't been forgiven by any stretch, and I know that Haruhi feels bad about what she did which speaks more to her development as a character than to the idea that he somehow didn't earn exactly what she gave him.
I dunno, maybe I'm just more spiteful than I'd really like to admit, but that's my view on it anyway.
Well....
My dislike if Koizumi isn't exclusively from that one horrible doujin, though that didn't help; I mostly dislike him just because (at least on the surface) Kyon does. Hum. Hal and I need to have that character study discussion to expand on that. Anyway.
I wasn't changing the outcome to actually be nicer to Koizumi -- in the original concept, he wasn't left to burn forever, either. There just wasn't a good way to bring it onscreen. Even then, it's not me, the author showing mercy to him, it's more that Haruhi has to be particularly vindictive and resentful to leave things at that.
Forever is a very long time -- and what I can see her doing when she was upset, well.... There's no good reason to keep it up when the thing that compelled her turned out to be as untrue as everything else he said-- She wanted him to suffer because she had been led to believe that Kyon, Mikuru, and Yuki were killed -- and it was because of Koizumi's manipulations that it happened. When she found out they were alive, continuing that punishment (and keep in mind, Haruhi thought she was going to die, too) didn't seem to have a purpose anymore.
I like to think that Koizumi was vastly humbled by the horrifying brush with a terrible fate that he had ... plus, it's probably fine for him to apply his 'treat her as more than human' view on thing to Kuyou. So ... yeah. :x
And thanks for the comments. :)
Act II!
I seem to be noting a lot of places to play up the awkward relationship between Haruhi and Koizumi a lot here; certainly, it's good as it stands, and likely using all of the points I suggest would probably be overkill, but I'm not finding a lot of other errors so I'll at least include those.
QuoteIt really felt almost exactly like watching the control center at NASA
"really felt almost exactly like" is an awful lot of modifying words. You could certainly drop 'really', and could even stand to lose 'almost exactly' without sacrificing much.
Quoteif I tried to undo it at that point.
Strikes me as a tense error. Should be if she tried to undo it at
this point, since (as far as she knows) any real action she could take would be in the present.
QuoteItsuki spent a great deal of time teaching me how important it was to be aware of my limitations.
Looked at this, thought about it for a moment, realized it was really good. I like the hidden emphasis that it's Koizumi doing things to her, not him helping her do things (i.e. 'helping me become aware' etc.) Going to look out for more good/bad examples of this throughout this act.
QuoteBetter than forgetting, being unable to grow, I suppose....
Ironic, given that she really -hasn't- had any chance to grow. Koizumi's leashed her too well to allow for that.
I'm really making a lot of comments that aren't particularly constructive and more along the lines of 'that bastard esper!', aren't I? =P
QuoteI wasn't sure what to feel about that, but once the experiment was done,
Merely a suggestion here, and this might just be due to my interpretation of the setup as it stands. It strikes me that this is less Haruhi not knowing how to feel and more that it makes her uncomfortable, but she doesn't want to contradict or make things difficult for Koizumi, so she clamps down on it. It's fine as written, but it might be something you could expand on if you feel like making some of the awkwardness between the two of them more explicit.
QuoteAs Itsuki said, I really needed to focus on my powers more than anything else.
Another possible point to expand on, although this one is kind of just reinforcing some of the groundwork already laid - that Koizumi has basically laid out all the boundaries and rules by which she has to live now. The one thing I can think that might be good in here somewhere (and this would be a decent place) is to see some spark of the old Haruhi, that would never put up with such a thing, but that she crushes that spark back down out of guilt - at least before her little trip into the past, anyway.
QuoteThose days, we got to meet with doctors and scholars
Semi-questionable tense - I'd use 'these' instead of 'those'. Tense in this chapter is a bit odd to me, for some reason - I want to read it as present, but when I actually look it's past.
I think part of the issue may be due to foreknowledge; I know there's a major change in outlook coming, but this is being written from the PoV of a Haruhi that sounds like she's still enmeshed in Koizumi's web, so there are some points that seem like they should be present tense (mostly suppositions) rather than past - so if it's being written in past tense, it seems like it can't be very far in the past.
QuoteHe was one of those rare people who saw me for _me_. Like--
Obvious that she was going to say Kyon here, but the omission of Koizumi is notable and makes me smirk. =)
QuoteWhen I first started out, I tried to make things flashy ... just
I'd suggest 'When I first started out with my abilities'. It's a little ambiguous, although the context does clear it up.
QuoteI had always thought she was cute -- her face was not suited to the scowl she sent at me.
These two ideas seem a little too disparate to connect with an em-dash; I'd suggest "I had always thought she was cute; the impression was only reinforced by how out of place the ugly/nasty scowl she sent me seemed."
Also, you have two uses of 'cute' in this paragraph. Maybe 'charming' or 'adorable' for one of them?
QuoteAre you going to get rid of me for being a bad toy,
This is a little out of place; Nonoko doesn't really have a reason to say she feels like Haruhi's toy right now, since she hasn't seen Haruhi in three years. The sentiment is good, though; I'd just reword: "Looking for a new toy to play with? One you can just throw away when you get bored with it, like you did to Nii-san?"
Quoteseveral hours walk from any cell phone signal
several hours' walk
---
Note for this scene in general: are they attracting any attention from onlookers at all? I'd assume that by this point, Haruhi's got one of the most recognizable faces in the world, if she's been doing so much to 'improve mankind'. Seeing her argue in the street with a girl five or six years younger than her would draw a crowd, I'd think - not just attention from one of Koizumi's goons.
Easy to solve either way; Haruhi can just do something like a Somebody Else's Problem field (people see them but don't pay attention), or meet Nonoko in some place where they're not terribly likely to see many other people - a quiet residential street, for example. The latter also makes it more pointed when the goon shows up, since why the hell would there be one in such an out of the way place?
QuoteI'm sorry, Itsuki.
I had to go back and look.
Suggestion given the change in tone for the scene; I'd alter the last line to: "I had to go back and look -- to find the truth for myself."
QuoteThe me from them hadn't
'me from then'. Might also clarify as 'the me from back then' - although you have that phrase in the very next line, I notice. Maybe 'my past self'?
QuoteKyon had tried to hit me once. In defense of Mikuru.
The second sentence here is a fragment, although this is easily dodged as stylistic. For technical accuracy, though, I'd just splice with an em-dash - no wording changes needed.
Quotewhen he was finally able ... forced, really ... to tell me the truth
This begs a bit of a question. We know -when- Koizumi popped the trump card on Haruhi, obviously. We also know some of what he said to her (the whole conspiracy thing). Why did he feel it was 'necessary' to tell her at that specific time - or at least, what did he tell her to make it seem like it was necessary?
It might not need clarification, but seeing this line does prompt the question.
Quote"Mikuru-chan is my toy!" the me from back then had cried.
At that moment, thinking of Nonoko's words ... I wanted nothing more than to help the Kyon of that time hit the me from back then.
Repetition of 'me from back then'. Suggest 'the person I had been' or 'my past self' here.
QuoteWhy did a time traveler, who should have known....
Seeing this brings up a question that had been bugging me earlier, but could have been set aside if Haruhi wasn't clear on what the other Brigade members were.
She knows that Koizumi is an esper (obviously, since she knows about the link.) She knows that Mikuru is a time traveler, and to do so would have to have been told. Presumably, then, she's also aware of Yuki as an alien and Kyon as a normal schlub. This does bring up several questions, although it's more with Koizumi's story than with the narrative as a whole.
1. If Koizumi traveled back to be John Smith, how? Why would the time travelers (who it's unclear whether Koizumi cast as one of the 'enemy groups' or not) extend such a favor to him, even under the mantle of predetermination?
2. If Yuki was the primary conspirator against Haruhi (as she stated to Nonoko), why would it have been necessary to break out the trump card while she was sick? (Possible explanation: she'd just had her trust in Kyon shattered by Mikuru, and with Yuki sick and Kyon unable to interfere, he actually -could- use it then. Still looks a little odd.)
3. If Yuki was the prime motivator in the 'plot' against Haruhi, why would the time travelers be helping her, if they were cast as such? Basically, it should look to Haruhi (now) like the time travelers were basically allied with Koizumi: they helped set him up as John Smith, and then through Mikuru they set things up so that Kyon could be disposed of. The really nasty part of that is that even without hearing or seeing much further, Haruhi could feasibly already have a good reason to feel even more angry at Mikuru for basically betraying Kyon to his death (particularly since she's obviously not dead herself) and to be ready to ream Koizumi when she gets back, since it appears that his allies (at the very least) set Kyon up to die just so Koizumi could use the trump card.
Sorry, I started that last point in one place and it ended up going somewhere else - but the final destination makes more sense, and I'm not sure exactly how I got the beginning now. @_@ Hopefully you see what I'm getting at, though - this now looks like a conspiracy between Mikuru and Koizumi to get rid of Yuki and Kyon. Haruhi might not have taken the time to consider much of this before, but all of this is based purely on what she knows about Mikuru and what Koizumi's cover story is - even without looking in the past, she could have worked this much out.
Admittedly, most of this doesn't hold up for long anyway if she believes what Mikuru(big) has to tell her, but she's sharp enough to work out a lot of this on the fly, I think. You might just end up discarding the whole thing - the scenes work as presented, I'm just trying to apply a bit more logic to Koizumi's story as more facts come to light and see what comes out of it.
QuoteI could return to the barest instant before I had left
Shouldn't this be the barest instant
after she had left?
QuoteI climbed the staircase at the side of the great lawn
I'd just say 'the staircase next to the bleachers' - this is all being done out in the sports field, I thought, so there should be a set of bleachers off to the side.
Haven't seen the anime for this, though, so if it's shown differently there by all means discard this.
QuoteHer working with some conspiracy?
Awkwardly worded. I'd suggest 'Was she working with...'
QuoteThen, even though it was difficult, he'd taught her to enjoy it, and to leave the past behind.
Man, esper-san is blind/dense.
And the esper roasts. In this fic, at least, I can't say it's terribly undeserved.
I think I see why you mentioned another medium for posting replies. I had a reply for ActIII/Epilogue almost ready to post, and then managed to misclick and hit backspace, unmaking the post completely -_-.
I feel like before I was making a lot of grammar corrections that may have just been stylistic fallacies on my part, and probably missed something more important. I also like I'm going to make the same corrections this time. Let's find out.
Act III
QuoteShe had...willed whatever she had done to Kyon to happen to her. Why hadn't anything happened?
I see what you're trying to do with the ellipsis, what with the stuttering and all; however, I feel like the stutter would work better as 'She had willed whatever she had done to Kyon to happen to her. Why...why hadn't anything happened?', or something like that.
Quote...she wanted to endure that, too.
It looks like she wants to endure that fate along with something else. I'd replace the [comma]
too with
herself.
Right, I'm just going to ignore the section with the Sky Canopy Dominion interface of uncertain nomenclature. 1.077*1011 seems like it's supposed to be scientific notation and is just missing a carrot between the 10 and 11, but that assumption is probably wrong.
I don't know. She should be talking in a more broken language, but not doing so is forgivable due to both ease of reading and writing.
QuoteWould I hurt, just as much?
The 'I hurt' construction isn't incorrect; however, 'it hurt' would be better in this specific situation, as you'd been using the end as the subject. The comma looks like it's trying to split the question into a question of t/f and a question of magnitude. I'm not sure how to correct this; if you want to recombine the question I'd go 'Would it hurt me just as much as it had hurt him?' or something like that.
QuoteA stray thought replaced... sun-dress.
I think someone else brought the issue up earlier, but again, should there be a hyphen in sundress/sun dress?
I kind of like how when Haruhi's observing Kyon's room she includes the bed in the list of things in the room. However, I think there are slightly better ways to phrase it while making that point.
QuoteI guess it's a guy's room, at a glance?
At a glance this looks grammatically awful. Further analysis seems to support this.
Oh hey, another sun-dress.
Haruhi's analysis about whether it's daytime or not seems...
It seems weird to see Nagato addressed as Yuki, but Haruhi's always called her that.
Oh hey, Kyon facepalming. Where have I seen that before?
Also, I just realized. I think everyone in that room is supposed to have feeling for Kyon considering how you set it up.
Not that there's a problem with Nagato not caring about that, but considering that she's a combination...
QuoteIt's strange to think of Mikuru as someone with enough confidence to chastize someone
I don't think
chastize is a word.
QuoteThere was so much to ask.... I couldn't think of where to begin yet, so reached for something inconsequential until I could settle down.
I think it should be 'so I reached for something inconsequential....'
Right. Now I'm not sure. Is this Adult!Mikuru or just Mikuru? The 'I'm older now' makes it look like she went to future or something for a few years then rejoined them. (For the record, where did that notation for variants come from?)
For the record, it's Sky Canopy Dominion, not Sky Canopy Domain.
Wouldn't Nagato's emotional state be due to the circumstances of the resplitting of the realities into...never mind. I'd reword that a bit though.
Quotehe is still my friend...
How does that answer Haruhi's question?
Of course, if you're going for a mysterious air for Nagato then that works.
Quote....since she's not you," he admits with a cautious smile.
I know I'm supposed to stay away from tenses and such, but I think you may have slipped into present.
The whole thing about there being no original Kyon in that world is incorrect. Remember that everyone's memories were only changed for one year into the past. Kyon is still the same Kyon in both worlds, he just has a year's worth of different memories.
I'd suggest giving him a doppelganger resembling that of the manga
Disappearance of Nagato Yuki(-chan), but that explanation would break down as soon as Nagato were to combine with the now unbroken version of her and leave.
QuoteI don't like that to them
Wait, what?
Quoteeven if they forgave me
For what exactly? Not actually doing anything to them? Wouldn't she have realized by now that she did nothing wrong to them, and that they're supporting her?
Now, there's a problem with the two of them trying to make up a year and a half of learning in half of one. Doesn't Japan go year round? I mean, Haruhi's powers, but...
However, they're also switching to the U.S. education system...
That's confusing.
Quote from: MikuruIt's the master bedroom, so there's more space, there!
Second comma. Burn it.
END ACT III
Epilogue
QuoteProbably, the funniest part was when Mikuru and I were both not thinking about a compromise, and making him feel conflicted by encouraging him to get closer to the other.
Meh, I'm not entirely sure about the structure of this one. I think I had some suggestion on how to fix it before, but I forget what that was. However, I think that replacing the
and with a
but (instead) fixes it.
QuoteShe liked being with us, and not in that sense.
It works grammatically, but I think that a
but works better than the
and.
Wait, so am I correct in assuming that Kyon is practicing bigamy? I think I found the squick you had mentioned.
It's rather...strange, especially considering how possessive Haruhi can be.
It's your story, and you're changing characterization anyway, so whatever.
QuoteBut...with Kyon, Mikuru, and Yuki all there, that was what really mattered to me.
I think here you're making their presence a condition for something else to be what really mattered to Haruhi. I'm not sure how to fix it, but...
QuoteFor all his claims not to be a genius, he picked up language and communication skills amazingly well, so pretty much took the 'easy route.'
so he pretty much took the 'easy route', which I don't think needs quotes.
QuoteI wasn't sure where I wanted to go with my studies at first, but I enojyed school.
Well, at least you're consistent with your spelling errors, barring the correct versions.
For the record, are you sure about Kyon's surname being before Haruhi's? I think that the speculation puts his name after some unknown person in the introduction order but before Taniguchi. I think that they had alternating m/f overlaid on top of Kanji-betical order.
For the record, 'Tanigawa' is actually in the list of possibilities for his name in this scheme. I'm not sure if the included possible starting pieces of names include stuff before 'Suzu', however.
Oh wait, you're the author.
I'd double check. It's not defined, so putting a detail about Kyon's surname being before 'Suzumiya' seems almost dangerous.
Right. I didn't really see much wrong with the epilogue, or either of the last two for that matter. Good job on this.
Quote from: BrianWhile appreciated, there's no rule about having to comment before you can post your own stories.
It's really more I found that I couldn't start a new topic without posting something first. As soon as I made my first post the 'New Topic' button appeared.
That, and I felt that I should try to help you guys out before asking for help.
Ok, Prologue and Ch. 1 of my stuff
will be up momentarily.are up.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AM
Act II!
I seem to be noting a lot of places to play up the awkward relationship between Haruhi and Koizumi a lot here; certainly, it's good as it stands, and likely using all of the points I suggest would probably be overkill, but I'm not finding a lot of other errors so I'll at least include those.
Yeah, I'll read over this once before replying, and figure which points benefit most from Koizumi-doubt. It seems to me probably anything after the Nonoko encounter will be fair game.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AM"really felt almost exactly like" is an awful lot of modifying words. You could certainly drop 'really', and could even stand to lose 'almost exactly' without sacrificing much.
Simple is good.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMStrikes me as a tense error. Should be if she tried to undo it at this point, since (as far as she knows) any real action she could take would be in the present.
Hmmm.... Not sure. I could drop everything after 'undo it' and sidestep the entire issue. I think I'll go that route -- there's another 'point' reference a few lines up, so this also avoids some repetition.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMLooked at this, thought about it for a moment, realized it was really good. I like the hidden emphasis that it's Koizumi doing things to her, not him helping her do things (i.e. 'helping me become aware' etc.) Going to look out for more good/bad examples of this throughout this act.
I thought this was one of the better moments to capture it, but it's generally positive to have them more up front than later; as it goes on it's kind of just hammering things in to the reader, and there's no real reason to be _too_ subtle given the final reveal.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMIronic, given that she really -hasn't- had any chance to grow. Koizumi's leashed her too well to allow for that.
I'm really making a lot of comments that aren't particularly constructive and more along the lines of 'that bastard esper!', aren't I? =P
Well, I think we share a bias, but it does reinforce that the scenes evoke what I wanted. Plus, you know me, I'm resistant, so you also are pushing me to play devil's advocate and not go overkill here.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteI wasn't sure what to feel about that, but once the experiment was done,
Merely a suggestion here, and this might just be due to my interpretation of the setup as it stands. It strikes me that this is less Haruhi not knowing how to feel and more that it makes her uncomfortable, but she doesn't want to contradict or make things difficult for Koizumi, so she clamps down on it. It's fine as written, but it might be something you could expand on if you feel like making some of the awkwardness between the two of them more explicit.
This seems like a good place for it, actually. Digressing into character-study mode a tiny bit, I think Haruhi enjoys winning/success, but would hate having things just handed to her. I know I've touched on it ... pretty much in every fic I've written where she's aware of her power, but I'll see what I can do to evoke that plus a sense of guilty neccesity over things. Also, while she wouldn't mind being recognized as superior, I think the implications of worship wouldn't sit well with her -- especially if (as above), it's something she feels she hasn't earned.
This strikes me as a really good point to expand, in retrospect. To show more of her being unsettled enough to investigate Nonoko, who she's been avoiding since the end of Act II. It also leads into her tutoring, so that could work quite nicely.
Quote from: revisionI wasn't sure what to say about that.
Any time I was praised for what I did with the powers, I got the sense that I was almost invisible, and it was the powers that everyone was really interested in. Of course, as Itsuki always reminded me, that was part of why I had a responsibility to use those powers for the benefit of everyone.
While I could use them for myself, I tried not to go overboard; I never feel like I'd earned whatever the powers accomplish. And it's hard to see those powers as 'fun' considering what I'd done with them the day Itsuki had to wake me up to the fact that I had them.
That thought looming, once the experiment was done, I teleported the pair of us back to Japan -- to our apartment. He went to his office to catch up on his notes and missed messages while we were away. For myself, I banished my exhaustion, and since it was afternoon there, teleported myself alone to the street outside of Hayate-kun's house.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteAs Itsuki said, I really needed to focus on my powers more than anything else.
Another possible point to expand on, although this one is kind of just reinforcing some of the groundwork already laid - that Koizumi has basically laid out all the boundaries and rules by which she has to live now. The one thing I can think that might be good in here somewhere (and this would be a decent place) is to see some spark of the old Haruhi, that would never put up with such a thing, but that she crushes that spark back down out of guilt - at least before her little trip into the past, anyway.
Alright -- the spark could be a good touch, too.
Quote from: revisionI didn't take money anymore, though; money was pretty meaningless to me by that point. I would have liked to have kept going to school, myself. As Itsuki said, I really needed to focus on my powers more than anything else. I wished I could have the freedom that other people did, just going to school or having simple jobs without concerns for....
That wasn't really a choice for me, though. With power comes responsibility, and considering the damage I'd done by being careless, wouldn't I be a monster to put my own wishes ahead of everything -- and everyone -- else? I couldn't afford to be that selfish -- never again.
So instead of going to school, those days, we got to meet with doctors and scholars to discuss whatever we really wanted to know more about, anyway.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteThose days, we got to meet with doctors and scholars
Semi-questionable tense - I'd use 'these' instead of 'those'. Tense in this chapter is a bit odd to me, for some reason - I want to read it as present, but when I actually look it's past.
I think part of the issue may be due to foreknowledge; I know there's a major change in outlook coming, but this is being written from the PoV of a Haruhi that sounds like she's still enmeshed in Koizumi's web, so there are some points that seem like they should be present tense (mostly suppositions) rather than past - so if it's being written in past tense, it seems like it can't be very far in the past.
Gotonis mentioned similar. Is it just that everyone's used to me doing first-person present-tense, I wonder?
Anyway -- revised the above and just dropped the 'those days.' Also replaced 'wanted' with 'needed.'
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMObvious that she was going to say Kyon here, but the omission of Koizumi is notable and makes me smirk. =)
Haruhi: "It takes epic guilt-motivated work to maintain this level of denial."
Koizumi: "There, there, Haruhi. I don't think anyone can blame you for killing all of your friends but me, but if it bothers you, just keep following my instructions, and everything will work out just fine."
Haruhi: ;_;
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMI'd suggest 'When I first started out with my abilities'. It's a little ambiguous, although the context does clear it up.
Just dropped that bit entirely, since it jars against her feeling guilty about having her powers.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteI had always thought she was cute -- her face was not suited to the scowl she sent at me.
These two ideas seem a little too disparate to connect with an em-dash; I'd suggest "I had always thought she was cute; the impression was only reinforced by how out of place the ugly/nasty scowl she sent me seemed."
Alright.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMAlso, you have two uses of 'cute' in this paragraph. Maybe 'charming' or 'adorable' for one of them?
Just dropped the second.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteAre you going to get rid of me for being a bad toy,
This is a little out of place; Nonoko doesn't really have a reason to say she feels like Haruhi's toy right now, since she hasn't seen Haruhi in three years. The sentiment is good, though; I'd just reword: "Looking for a new toy to play with? One you can just throw away when you get bored with it, like you did to Nii-san?"
I'm not sure that really fits, either. Well, thematically, yes, but wording-wise.... So, revision is good.
Quote from: revision"What do you want with me?" she snapped, her dark eyes hardening further. "You threw Nii-san aside like a _toy_, so do you plan on treating me the same?"
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMNote for this scene in general: are they attracting any attention from onlookers at all? I'd assume that by this point, Haruhi's got one of the most recognizable faces in the world, if she's been doing so much to 'improve mankind'. Seeing her argue in the street with a girl five or six years younger than her would draw a crowd, I'd think - not just attention from one of Koizumi's goons.
Easy to solve either way; Haruhi can just do something like a Somebody Else's Problem field (people see them but don't pay attention), or meet Nonoko in some place where they're not terribly likely to see many other people - a quiet residential street, for example. The latter also makes it more pointed when the goon shows up, since why the hell would there be one in such an out of the way place?
I mentioned people were looking, yeah. Easy to revise Haruhi to finding her in an otherwise-empty street, though. The 'SEP' effect from Haruhi comes uncomfortably close to mind-control, something she'd abhor after everything (also, would raise the question of how the goon spotted her).
So, back up to the opening paragraph of this scene:
Quote from: revisionI held together through Hayate-kun's lessons easily enough, but when they were done, I didn't even bother to walk out. I spent an instant to know where she was -- not in a bath, or somewhere else private -- and sent myself there. We were standing on the sidewalk of an otherwise empty street downtown, in a residential district not far from a cram school. At a guess, she was headed back towards where I still remembered that she and Kyon lived.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMSuggestion given the change in tone for the scene; I'd alter the last line to: "I had to go back and look -- to find the truth for myself."
Dropped the 'for myself', but otherwise used that.
Hmm. This raises issues with tenses, in retrospect, since 'I'm' is present. Hmm. I'll let it slide for stylism.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AM'me from then'. Might also clarify as 'the me from back then' - although you have that phrase in the very next line, I notice. Maybe 'my past self'?
There's no good term without going into spanner-slang. :\
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMThe second sentence here is a fragment, although this is easily dodged as stylistic. For technical accuracy, though, I'd just splice with an em-dash - no wording changes needed.
Alright.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuotewhen he was finally able ... forced, really ... to tell me the truth
This begs a bit of a question. We know -when- Koizumi popped the trump card on Haruhi, obviously. We also know some of what he said to her (the whole conspiracy thing). Why did he feel it was 'necessary' to tell her at that specific time - or at least, what did he tell her to make it seem like it was necessary?
It might not need clarification, but seeing this line does prompt the question.
O_o?
Koizumi: "Haruhi, you have vast powers, and by using them wrong, you killed three of your friends. It's okay, though, because they were all evil and plotting against you."
Haruhi: "I don't buy it."
Koizumi: "Also, I'm John Smith. Remember when I helped you draw that symbol?"
Haruhi: "...I think I hate myself. ;_;"
Koizumi: "Just take my advice, don't think about it too hard, and everything will work out fine."
So ... it wasn't because he felt he had to. It was just an opportunity for him to remove the competition from the field. (Even bigger jerkwad Koizumi, yes, I know....)
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMRepetition of 'me from back then'. Suggest 'the person I had been' or 'my past self' here.
Which then moves the repetition issue to the next sentence, which you omitted from your quote. >_>'
Revised that to just be 'me' instead of bothering to include a chronological reference -- she can feel the guilt directly.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMSeeing this brings up a question that had been bugging me earlier, but could have been set aside if Haruhi wasn't clear on what the other Brigade members were.
She knows that Koizumi is an esper (obviously, since she knows about the link.) She knows that Mikuru is a time traveler, and to do so would have to have been told. Presumably, then, she's also aware of Yuki as an alien and Kyon as a normal schlub. This does bring up several questions, although it's more with Koizumi's story than with the narrative as a whole.
1. If Koizumi traveled back to be John Smith, how? Why would the time travelers (who it's unclear whether Koizumi cast as one of the 'enemy groups' or not) extend such a favor to him, even under the mantle of predetermination?
Doesn't predetermination really cover all the justification they need, though? That also makes things worse for Haruhi, since according to the future, her friends couldn't be saved (by Koizumi's story).
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AM2. If Yuki was the primary conspirator against Haruhi (as she stated to Nonoko), why would it have been necessary to break out the trump card while she was sick? (Possible explanation: she'd just had her trust in Kyon shattered by Mikuru, and with Yuki sick and Kyon unable to interfere, he actually -could- use it then. Still looks a little odd.)
Ah ... nope, don't see direct implications that Yuki was the primary conspirator.
Quote from: original"Your brother was planning to betray me -- he was working with Yuki and enemy groups behind my back to get rid of me! What I did ... the reason I can even live with myself at all ... is because it was subconscious on my part to defend myself! It really _was_ self-defense! ...but at the same time ... if I understood my powers better, he wouldn't have had to--"
To me, this implicates Kyon more than Yuki. I can revise this and make it even clearer, if it's not working for you.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMAdmittedly, most of this doesn't hold up for long anyway if she believes what Mikuru(big) has to tell her, but she's sharp enough to work out a lot of this on the fly, I think. You might just end up discarding the whole thing - the scenes work as presented, I'm just trying to apply a bit more logic to Koizumi's story as more facts come to light and see what comes out of it.
It's not a good story, no, and Haruhi (it should be fairly obvious) knows something isn't right about it, but lacks the wherewithal to do anything about it until after encountering Nonoko again.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMQuoteI climbed the staircase at the side of the great lawn
I'd just say 'the staircase next to the bleachers' - this is all being done out in the sports field, I thought, so there should be a set of bleachers off to the side.
Don't recall there being bleachers. Staircase up to the main building, then.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 11:36:19 AMAnd the esper roasts. In this fic, at least, I can't say it's terribly undeserved.
:D
Alright -- thanks a ton for the feedback, Hal.
A couple of clarifications:
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PM
Quote from: revisionI wasn't sure what to say about that.
Any time I was praised for what I did with the powers, I got the sense that I was almost invisible, and it was the powers that everyone was really interested in. Of course, as Itsuki always reminded me, that was part of why I had a responsibility to use those powers for the benefit of everyone.
While I could use them for myself, I tried not to go overboard; I never feel like I'd earned whatever the powers accomplish. And it's hard to see those powers as 'fun' considering what I'd done with them the day Itsuki had to wake me up to the fact that I had them.
That thought looming, once the experiment was done, I teleported the pair of us back to Japan -- to our apartment. He went to his office to catch up on his notes and missed messages while we were away. For myself, I banished my exhaustion, and since it was afternoon there, teleported myself alone to the street outside of Hayate-kun's house.
Minor suggestion (and easily discardable): if you want to show Haruhi with a bit more of that spark from the next suggestion, consider changing 'always' to 'constantly' in the second sentence. Shows some of her dissatisfaction with the way Koizumi treats her.
I'm not a nice person at all.
There's also some tense oddity here: 'accomplished', 'it was' rather than 'it's'.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PM
Gotonis mentioned similar. Is it just that everyone's used to me doing first-person present-tense, I wonder?
Anyway -- revised the above and just dropped the 'those days.' Also replaced 'wanted' with 'needed.'
I don't really think so? It's more that there's a sense of immediacy to what Haruhi has to say, so I want to interpret it as present tense. It doesn't feel like a memoir for some reason.
It works as it is - the story is communicated just fine and the tense doesn't really detract at all, just throws me off on closer examination - which most readers won't bother with.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PM
There's no good term without going into spanner-slang. :\
Douglas Adams was right. The real issue with time travel is tenses.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PM
So ... it wasn't because he felt he had to. It was just an opportunity for him to remove the competition from the field. (Even bigger jerkwad Koizumi, yes, I know....)
Oh, I know it's because it was actually convenient for him - this is just picking more holes in his story. Apparently what he told Haruhi made it sound like he -had- to tell her at that point, and the question that's bugging me is 'why? what makes that point significant or -require- that he pop the card there?'
Again, doesn't really need story clarification, just something I wonder, I wonder.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PM
To me, this implicates Kyon more than Yuki. I can revise this and make it even clearer, if it's not working for you.
That actually strikes me as -less- plausible, though. Might be my own view of Haruhi impinging here, but I can't see her buying (even in this circumstance) that Kyon was masterminding some kind of plot against her. Participating in one? That could be swallowed, but not running things; if nothing else, he's too much of a slacker to keep something like that going. It'd need some other person to be the real driving force behind it, and with the emphasis on Yuki in a couple of spots, that's why I was under the impression that it was her plot and Kyon was pulled into helping her with it.
For Act II:
Our narrator (there isn't a good hint to who she is until "even though my presence meant ... everyone else could [make a mistake]) is in some kind of control center, overseeing...something.
QuoteIt really felt almost exactly like watching the control center at NASA in one of those movies, except instead of windows, there was a bank of enormous monitors. I could read the graphs a little bit, and had a fair understanding of what it all meant, but I didn't really get all the details yet. I would, even though I didn't really need to. I just hadn't yet, since I'd been so busy training....
I'm confused by "windows"--as many times as I've watched
Apollo 13, I don't recall windows in Mission Control there, but you may be drawing on some other source that's more accurate to something modern?
Haruhi talks about how the consequences of losing her self-control.
QuoteWith Itsuki's help, I was ... still upset, but they deserved better than that. It was too far, but ... things would go horribly wrong if I tried to undo it at that point.
What was too far? If anything, I'd think what she should emphasize is that, while she
could go back and change the event, she couldn't guarantee there wouldn't be other, more damaging consequences. At least, if I remember Koizumi's argument correctly.
QuoteI shouldn't tamper with my own mind. If I were to make a mistake, who then could fix it? I shouldn't tamper with things that are delicate, or that no one at all understands yet -- like time travel. I shouldn't make things that can behave unpredictably or dangerously without my supervision.
"who then" seems all right, but maybe "who else" instead?
QuoteIt was strange how the details from things that have happened over three years ago could still gnaw at me.
I suggest "had happened"?
Koizumi has been giving Haruhi guidance--they're on a first-name basis--but Haruhi hesitates to show affection for him publicly. At least, not too much. Telling.
QuoteIf a black hole formed, then I'd prevent anything disastrous -- absolutely, I'd prevent anyone getting hurt. If the machinery broke, I could fix that ... though with time, they wouldn't really need me at all.
I think I probably commented on this the first time. A black hole of any terrestrial size would evaporate and disappear well before it could do any damage. At least, that's the theory. I can appreciate the idea that, with a reality warper at one's disposal, no one sees the need to rely solely on theory to protect them. If they happen to be wrong and a black hole doesn't evaporate fast enough to prevent catastrophe, it would look a bit silly.
----
Haruhi and Koizumi have an apartment together. Haruhi goes to Hayate's house. Haruhi remarks on how tutoring allows her to keep feeling normal--it's a remarkable point that she
wants to feel normal, one that isn't explored at that exact moment. Perhaps that's later?
QuoteI realized I was still wearing the semi-formal suit and skirt, so before I knocked, a thought shifted it into more casual jeans and a loose blue shirt. Another thought removed the makeup from my face and let my hair relax from the command I'd given it to stay as if permed. For the final touch, a falling leaf shot on an unusual trajectory straight to my fingertips before it became a gold ribbon.
"shifted it" -> "shifted them" or some other plural for agreement.
QuoteI didn't take money anymore, though; money was pretty meaningless to me by that point. I would have liked to have kept going to school, myself, but there wasn't much point. As Itsuki said, I really needed to focus on my powers more than anything else.
Point and point, though used in different senses. That might make it all right.
Haruhi doesn't bother with school, preferring something more free form. This also means she's isolated from peers, which would strengthen Koizumi's hold over her, wouldn't it?
Quote"Ah?" he started, blinking. He recognized me and gave me the friendly smile that told me he hadn't learned to be afraid of what everyone knew I could do -- like his parents had. He was one of those rare people who saw me for me. Like--
Like Koizumi? No, like Kyon. Her guilt and positive view of him leak through despite what ideas about him Koizumi's poisoned her mind with.
Hayate relates how he met Nonoko, and Haruhi puts aside those uncomfortable feelings, promising to speak with Nonoko later and square things away.
----
Haruhi teleports herself to Nonoko's location on a street near Kyon's home. They have a staring contest for a while.
QuoteWell ... he might say such words, but I don't recall that he would ever use so much venom. I knew, of course, from what Hayate had said, but I felt somehow the question needed to be asked.
Would this be better with "I knew
why"?
QuoteShe called him 'Brother,' not 'Kyon.' He confided in me once that he'd always wanted her to call him that again ... and it was only after....
Oh, poor Nonoko. That sometimes we only honor our loved ones as much as we should after death--it tugs at the heartstrings, man. Haruhi is right to be affected by this.
Quote"People ... aren't toys, Nonoko. That was an accident," I told her gravely. "If you think I'm like that ... that I would intentionally do such a thing.... But even then ... even if he deserved better...." I trailed off, and had to use Itsuki's words, when my own failed me: "He was plotting behind my back, you know. Itsuki told me that -- he once suggested that I was dangerous, and should be killed."
Haruhi is hesitant, yes, but there are a lot of ellipses here, and in the piece in general. While I'm not saying this is what you should do (because while I notice there are a lot of ellipses, they don't particularly bother me), you could do something like this:
Quote from: possible ellipsis trimming"People ... aren't toys, Nonoko. That was an accident," I told her gravely. "If you think I'm like that -- that I would intentionally do such a thing.... But even then, even if he deserved better...." I trailed off, and had to use Itsuki's words, when my own failed me: "He was plotting behind my back, you know. Itsuki told me that -- he once suggested that I was dangerous, and should be killed."
Really, only some of them seem like they could be replaced with different punctuation, and I know how much that has to suit taste.
Again, I think it's very good, very telling that Haruhi can't express the belief that Kyon betrayed her in her own words and has to paraphrase Koizumi's flat and factual explanation. She accepts that Koizumi thinks this way and has taken it as fact even without feeling convinced of it on the inside, or that's how I read it.
Quote"And that makes it right?!" she exclaimed, standing rigid, hands balled into fists at her sides. Somewhere, down the street, one of Itsuki's men began moving towards us. I recognized him by the earpiece and his quick stride, so a thought sent him somewhere else -- a beach in Hokkaido several hours walk from any cell phone signal, or other people. It was a safe place, though; he'd be fine, and I didn't want that interruption.
I think, of long
o sounds are
ou, then it's
Hokkaidou, but it's not like anyone I've seen writes it that way.
Again, telling: Koizumi can't have known Haruhi would be there, so he must've had Nonoko under surveillance. Haruhi doesn't make this connection quite yet, though. That's later.
QuoteI just-- I never would have done a thing if he hadn't tried to move against me first! But.... What had I really hoped for, confronting her like that? Why would she insist that it wasn't true?
Is it "why would" or "why wouldn't"?
In truth, I find the end of this scene a bit empty. Haruhi understands that she must win this argument with words, not force. She wants Nonoko's forgiveness, and confronting the girl with the truth is logical. If Nonoko can accept that Kyon did plot against Haruhi, then they can come to understanding.
But then, suddenly, Haruhi considers the possibility that Koizumi was wrong. The switch in thinking goes like this:
QuoteThis was a fight I needed to win with words, not force. But the truth.... The truth of it....
How long had I been trying to avoid thinking about this? How long had I just accepted what I was told, because it was easier than facing....
I feel like there's a vital component missing to Haruhi's thought process. It might be that I misinterpreted the "would she insist" part above, that Haruhi is genuinely surprised by Nonoko's unwavering belief in Kyon--but if so, it makes her estimation of Nonoko a lot more nuanced. What did Haruhi expect? That Kyon's sister was angry with her
despite knowing how Kyon tried to betray her? And is there good reason to tell Nonoko about that betrayal at all at that point?
If I haven't misunderstood, then what it seems to me is that something about Nonoko says needs to strike a chord with Haruhi. Again, Nonoko's absolute, unwavering belief in Kyon is the key. Haruhi could convince herself that she used to feel the same way, which is why it's so difficult to argue because when she does, she has to use Koizumi's words. On an intellectual level, she can believe Kyon betrayed her, but not on an emotional one. I think this is what you intended to do; it just doesn't hit me because Haruhi changes her mind so fast, in my opinion. Personally, I can see Haruhi recalling how Koizumi dropped the ball on her and how she vehemently rejected it, only to accept it later because she couldn't stand the possibility she'd erased Kyon, Asahina, and Nagato for no reason at all. Nonoko's certainty here could remind Haruhi of her own back then.
There's another way to go about it instead, where Haruhi feels that doubt and then dismisses it, choosing instead to prove Nonoko wrong by seeing what happened for herself to give her argument all the more surety, but again, I don't think this is what you intended.
And, it could be this is all fine, and I'm just making too much of a small thing, so don't worry about it too much if what I say there doesn't resonate.
----
Haruhi goes back to
Sigh.
QuotePathetic. The me from them hadn't had the courage of Kyon's sister when she glared at me.
"Them" -> "then"
Haruhi rewiinds a good bit to find out when Kyon became angry. I guess she's trying to figure out when Kyon might've gained the nerve to move against her?
QuoteI let the scene play forward again, intangible. Yuki herself walked right through me without reacting.
This briefly gives the impression the scene was intangible, but only briefly.
QuoteThe image of Kyon stormed away. I had no need to watch my past self tremble and numbly record over the footage that had angered him once he left -- I remembered it well enough. No need to watch myself think nothing except that he had been right for hours.
Interesting that even back then, Haruhi realized she had been in the wrong.
----
And the tape plays into Haruhi acknowledging that she had feelings for Kyon. She follows Koizumi and Kyon, realizing that what Koizumi said about that time doesn't appear to be true.
QuoteBut that image of him ... that was more like the Kyon I remembered. He looked more haggard, angry at his situation, and upset about Itsuki pressuring him. And why wouldn't he?
Perhaps "why wouldn't he
be"?
QuoteI didn't know what to feel -- after encountering Nonoko, then going back and making myself look at this.... I wanted someone to tell me that it was okay; to hold me and give me what I needed to somehow feel better -- to have everything somehow be okay. I couldn't run back to Itsuki, though -- not yet. No matter what I wanted ... I needed to find the truth.
Not sure what to do about this repetition.
QuoteI didn't immediately recognize the woman in the room, staring at the costume rack with a sweet smile -- frozen, like all time was for the moment. She was dressed well enough, and looked like a very attractive young teacher. Something about her seemed familiar, and I studied the unknown for a while before resuming time. She would introduce herself to Kyon, wouldn't she?
I feel like this might be more natural if it were "unknown
person"?
Quote"I swear to you," Mikuru said, her voice surprisingly gentle, sorrowfully sympathetic. "Suzumiya-san ... never have I done anything to act against you or Kyon -- everything I've ever done was to preserve the stability of the time-planes. Truthfully, I can't act here, in these times ... physically, I can't have any effect. Only through information can I provide any impact ... that's simply a limitation of classified--"
Kyon-kun?
Quote"Suzumiya-san ... would Kyon kissing someone else truly do such a thing? Would it be so destructive and dangerous to you?"
And again.
Something about this scene too seems incomplete; Haruhi doesn't press Asahina about how she survived. I'm not sure if, were I in her position, I would believe her--that Kyon and Nagato couldn't be saved--without knowing that detail. But, perhaps it's largely irrelevant.
----
Haruhi doesn't realize just how significant the difference in John Smith's voice from Koizumi's is. She does figure out that Koizumi's men must've been following Nonoko. Only now does she realize Koizumi's lied to her--not just that he was mistaken about why she erased Kyon, but that he absolutely lied. And knowing that Kyon is the true John Smith seals the deal.
----
Perspective change.
Koizumi is a slick bastard but feels his manipulations are for good. Nevertheless, he has to keep Haruhi under control. No sympathy here for trying to throw all the memorabillia away and keep Haruhi's mind off Kyon, necessary though it may be to preserve his interests.
Jealousy. Koizumi knows that Kyon would survive with Haruhi even if the world had changed. Good times.
Haruhi challenges him on why Nonoko is important and the last thing John Smith said to her. Koizumi handles these questions as best he can, growing increasingly uneasy.
QuoteShe paused for a moment, while he could still open one eye, the other already squinted shut against the pain, looking at him with an empty, regretful expression. It was hard for him to think straight, and he was sinking to the ground -- staying upright was too hard. There was smoke, faintly, the scent of--
I think the modifies get a bet jumbled here in the first sentence. Until we get to
him it feels like Koizumi is looking, especially with the focus on Koizumi's eyes. Perhaps, instead of "looking", try "and looked".
I wonder why you chose to go back to third-person here. It seems to me that this scene could be done from Haruhi's perspective, with her scornfully realizing how pathetic his excuses are. Then again, I know that would be very, very intense.
I ommitted some of your comments because I couldn't find a constructive way to reply to them.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMI think I see why you mentioned another medium for posting replies. I had a reply for ActIII/Epilogue almost ready to post, and then managed to misclick and hit backspace, unmaking the post completely -_-.
That's ... pretty much it exactly. >_>;
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMI feel like before I was making a lot of grammar corrections that may have just been stylistic fallacies on my part, and probably missed something more important. I also like I'm going to make the same corrections this time. Let's find out.
You also like? Is there a missing 'feel' there? :p
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteShe had...willed whatever she had done to Kyon to happen to her. Why hadn't anything happened?
I see what you're trying to do with the ellipsis, what with the stuttering and all; however, I feel like the stutter would work better as 'She had willed whatever she had done to Kyon to happen to her. Why...why hadn't anything happened?', or something like that.
Moved the ellipsis between 'willed' and 'whatever'.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuote...she wanted to endure that, too.
It looks like she wants to endure that fate along with something else. I'd replace the [comma] too with herself.
That's correct? She wants to endure what Kyon did, feeling it's deserved after what she's done.
For flow, replaced 'too' with 'as well'.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMRight, I'm just going to ignore the section with the Sky Canopy Dominion interface of uncertain nomenclature. 1.077*1011 seems like it's supposed to be scientific notation and is just missing a carrot between the 10 and 11, but that assumption is probably wrong.
Hmm, the <super> tag seems to not work at all. The caret will go back in.
The time reference is measuring time in rotations of a black hole at maximum velocity, a kind of running gag/reference to Kuyou's characterization in K:BDH.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMI don't know. She should be talking in a more broken language, but not doing so is forgivable due to both ease of reading and writing.
...and also because she directly states that what was preventing clear communication is now resolved.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteWould I hurt, just as much?
The 'I hurt' construction isn't incorrect; however, 'it hurt' would be better in this specific situation, as you'd been using the end as the subject. The comma looks like it's trying to split the question into a question of t/f and a question of magnitude. I'm not sure how to correct this; if you want to recombine the question I'd go 'Would it hurt me just as much as it had hurt him?' or something like that.
Well, she expects something unpleasant. I think just omitting the comma will work for that.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMI think someone else brought the issue up earlier, but again, should there be a hyphen in sundress/sun dress?
Nope. Will fix that.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteI guess it's a guy's room, at a glance?
At a glance this looks grammatically awful. Further analysis seems to support this.
...and? I don't understand what's wrong. I'm not even going to try to fix it if you can't give me more information on what the error is. A somewhat smart-alecky comment saying, "You got it wrong!" and nothing else....
Anyway. Overcoming my irritation, I notice that there is an issue with repetition on 'at a glance,' so will omit the second instance.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMI don't think chastize is a word.
Difference between British and American spellings of the word:
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chastize
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMRight. Now I'm not sure. Is this Adult!Mikuru or just Mikuru? The 'I'm older now' makes it look like she went to future or something for a few years then rejoined them. (For the record, where did that notation for variants come from?)
Assuming one-way trip and no paradox, adult. Then again, it's been three years, so even the small one would have grown up.
And I don't know. Coders, I guess.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMFor the record, it's Sky Canopy Dominion, not Sky Canopy Domain.
Po-tay-to, po-tah-to -- it's a translation issue with some fuzziness around it -- like arguing about the 'Data Thought Entity' vs. 'Data Sentience Entity.' Internal consistency trumps accuracy.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuotehe is still my friend...
How does that answer Haruhi's question?
Of course, if you're going for a mysterious air for Nagato then that works.
Ah, that's a good chance for me to expand on Yuki's answer and have it be a bit more complete -- thanks for the catch.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuote....since she's not you," he admits with a cautious smile.
I know I'm supposed to stay away from tenses and such, but I think you may have slipped into present.
Nope, that's an actual tense error. Fixed.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMThe whole thing about there being no original Kyon in that world is incorrect. Remember that everyone's memories were only changed for one year into the past. Kyon is still the same Kyon in both worlds, he just has a year's worth of different memories.
No, I don't agree, sorry. While memories could have been changed and etc., then there's a genuine paradox. Namely, that Ryouko can't do anything in the disappearance universe because she would have gotten erased.
Anyway -- even if I'm somehow wrong, for the purposes of this story, as Yuki explained, another reality was created to house the segments of the temporal loop that Kyon occupied. In other words, as I see things (and how it does work for this story), Ryouko was erased in the prime reality, but not the Disappearance universe. I don't feel any need to commit myself to a more depressing interpretation. (Sadly, this is not the first time I've had this discussion, but the last one compelled me to always accept mine over the other, as it's too depressing and is a poor fit for the proper tone of the novels, IMO.)
Here's the line:
Quote from: original"To prevent a collapse of causality, it was required that events that happened in an alternate future still happen -- therefore, reality itself was split, and a second stable copy came into being," Yuki elaborated.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteI don't like that to them
Wait, what?
I'm sorry, this isn't constructive commentary. Presumably there's something wrong here, but you're not telling me what. Try to avoid just being snarky or throwing out disdainful comments 'for the lulz,; that is not what this community is about.
As it is, your tone is setting my teeth on edge. If I'm becoming dismissive to your comments, it's because I find your tone insulting, so, sorry if you did that on accident.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteeven if they forgave me
For what exactly? Not actually doing anything to them? Wouldn't she have realized by now that she did nothing wrong to them, and that they're supporting her?
Guilt isn't perfectly logical. She feels bad, so blames herself. Obviously they don't, but three years of dealing with what she had isn't healed in a day.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMNow, there's a problem with the two of them trying to make up a year and a half of learning in half of one. Doesn't Japan go year round? I mean, Haruhi's powers, but...
However, they're also switching to the U.S. education system...
That's confusing.
I don't even know where to begin with this one....
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuote from: MikuruIt's the master bedroom, so there's more space, there!
Second comma. Burn it.
Dropped the 'there' as well.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteProbably, the funniest part was when Mikuru and I were both not thinking about a compromise, and making him feel conflicted by encouraging him to get closer to the other.
Meh, I'm not entirely sure about the structure of this one. I think I had some suggestion on how to fix it before, but I forget what that was. However, I think that replacing the and with a but (instead) fixes it.
This looks like a job for an emdash.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteShe liked being with us, and not in that sense.
It works grammatically, but I think that a but works better than the and.
Went with 'just' and added emphasis to 'that'.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteI wasn't sure where I wanted to go with my studies at first, but I enojyed school.
Well, at least you're consistent with your spelling errors, barring the correct versions.
You do realize what sort of response to your own fic you're engendering here, right? I'm trying to be polite, but my patience is
severely strained at this point.
I'm not going to reply in kind, but I think you should be aware of just what a jerk you're portraying yourself as.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuote from: BrianWhile appreciated, there's no rule about having to comment before you can post your own stories.
It's really more I found that I couldn't start a new topic without posting something first. As soon as I made my first post the 'New Topic' button appeared.
That's to encourage people to post in the 'introductions' thread, I think.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMOk, Prologue and Ch. 1 of my stuff will be up momentarily.are up.
I'll let my temper cool off before I have a look. I don't think you'd appreciate the tone of comments your own C&C has engendered.
Thanks for trying, sorry I'm too pissed off to be more grateful.
Right. It would seem that in my attempts to befriend people by being helpful, I have managed to display myself as annoying and snarky. I sincerely apologize.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 09:12:47 PM
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteI don't like that to them
Wait, what?
I'm sorry, this isn't constructive commentary. Presumably there's something wrong here, but you're not telling me what. Try to avoid just being snarky or throwing out disdainful comments 'for the lulz,; that is not what this community is about.
As it is, your tone is setting my teeth on edge. If I'm becoming dismissive to your comments, it's because I find your tone insulting, so, sorry if you did that on accident.
Yeah, I don't know. That line seemed rather confusing, but I wasn't sure how to explain. Again, I apologize for my tone. I guess at first I was being extra careful about it, then as things seemed to get relaxed I stopped listening to myself before I spoke. You don't need to apologize; it was my fault completely and I have no excuse.
Quote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 09:12:47 PM
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 03:39:34 PMQuoteI wasn't sure where I wanted to go with my studies at first, but I enojyed school.
Well, at least you're consistent with your spelling errors, barring the correct versions.
You do realize what sort of response to your own fic you're engendering here, right? I'm trying to be polite, but my patience is severely strained at this point.
I'm not going to reply in kind, but I think you should be aware of just what a jerk you're portraying yourself as.
Yeah...
Don't use sarcasm. Got it. For some reason that seemed more like lightly witty in my head, but looking back...
I'm sorry. This REALLY wasn't my intention.
Right now I'm just wondering how I can redeem myself. I see how far out of line my tone was, and I'll try not to do it again in the future.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMA couple of clarifications:
A couple replies.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMMinor suggestion (and easily discardable): if you want to show Haruhi with a bit more of that spark from the next suggestion, consider changing 'always' to 'constantly' in the second sentence. Shows some of her dissatisfaction with the way Koizumi treats her.
Heh, I think I should stop where it is, though. 'Constantly' makes it a bit too obvious, I think. >.>;
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMI'm not a nice person at all.
We should make a club!
...oh, wait, we already did. :3
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMThere's also some tense oddity here: 'accomplished', 'it was' rather than 'it's'.
Aha, thanks for the catches. I kept slipping into present tense when I do the corrections. ;D
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMQuote from: Brian on March 04, 2012, 04:07:15 PMThere's no good term without going into spanner-slang. :\
Douglas Adams was right. The real issue with time travel is tenses.
...would Haruhi know spanner-slang? I think she might, but I can't expect the readers to. :p
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMAgain, doesn't really need story clarification, just something I wonder, I wonder.
Those eyes are worrying me....
Quote from: Halbarad on March 04, 2012, 05:55:29 PMThat actually strikes me as -less- plausible, though. Might be my own view of Haruhi impinging here, but I can't see her buying (even in this circumstance) that Kyon was masterminding some kind of plot against her. Participating in one? That could be swallowed, but not running things; if nothing else, he's too much of a slacker to keep something like that going. It'd need some other person to be the real driving force behind it, and with the emphasis on Yuki in a couple of spots, that's why I was under the impression that it was her plot and Kyon was pulled into helping her with it.
Yeah, it's not a perfect story. I'm okay with Koizumi's story being flawed, but Haruhi trying to make herself go along with it because she's
that horrified over the idea of hurting Kyon/Yuki/Mikuru, even if it was in 'self defense.'
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMOur narrator (there isn't a good hint to who she is until "even though my presence meant ... everyone else could [make a mistake]) is in some kind of control center, overseeing...something.
Decided not to risk trying to be accurate in favor of being vague. I know you'd catch that I got it wrong, at the very least. :p
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteIt really felt almost exactly like watching the control center at NASA in one of those movies, except instead of windows, there was a bank of enormous monitors. I could read the graphs a little bit, and had a fair understanding of what it all meant, but I didn't really get all the details yet. I would, even though I didn't really need to. I just hadn't yet, since I'd been so busy training....
I'm confused by "windows"--as many times as I've watched Apollo 13, I don't recall windows in Mission Control there, but you may be drawing on some other source that's more accurate to something modern?
You know, I don't recall windows in
Apollo 13, either, but Haruhi's not drawing on accurate sci-fi for her sources, and I do recall a set (that's probably been re-used in multiple films now that I think about it -- probably why the image is ingrained in my mind) that actually has a clear view of the shuttle launch pad itself. Yes, again, unrealistic, but Haruhi's recalling from movies she's watched, and I would put her as more into even slight sci-fi over documentaries, almost any day of the week (unless they're documentaries of the supernatural).
And after googling for such an image, I find a lot of references that confirm mission control lacks windows, and nothing even close to my 'memory.' I wonder what I'm actually thinking.... Dang.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteWith Itsuki's help, I was ... still upset, but they deserved better than that. It was too far, but ... things would go horribly wrong if I tried to undo it at that point.
What was too far? If anything, I'd think what she should emphasize is that, while she could go back and change the event, she couldn't guarantee there wouldn't be other, more damaging consequences. At least, if I remember Koizumi's argument correctly.
Hmm.
Quote from: revisionI wouldn't let it happen again.
With Itsuki's help, I was ... still upset, but they deserved better than that. It was too far, but ... things would go horribly wrong if I tried to undo it. I could have tried, but what about the consequences? Who knew how that could strain causality? And Itsuki would have known -- he'd gotten assistance from genuine time travelers in the past ... something about 'predetermination,' and the future recording that I wasn't successful.
That was encouragement enough not to try, and end up with....
It wasn't something I wanted to think about.
So that was a very painful lesson about being careful ... about how destructive my powers can be, if used carelessly. I can't wander through time, no matter how much I might want to. If I go into the past without understanding things, I could cause serious damage. If I go to the future, my present becomes the past, and I can't safely come back.
There we go.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI shouldn't tamper with my own mind. If I were to make a mistake, who then could fix it? I shouldn't tamper with things that are delicate, or that no one at all understands yet -- like time travel. I shouldn't make things that can behave unpredictably or dangerously without my supervision.
"who then" seems all right, but maybe "who else" instead?
Alright. I need to revise slightly and expand on Koizumi's knowledge of time travel anyway.
Quote from: revisionI shouldn't tamper with my own mind. If I were to make a mistake, then who else could fix it? I shouldn't tamper with things that are delicate, or that no one at all understands yet -- like time travel. Itsuki understood a little, but even having _done_ it, he'd warned me it was difficult for him to understand much of at all -- beyond predetermination, anyway. I shouldn't make things that can behave unpredictably or dangerously without my supervision.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMI suggest "had happened"?
Oop. Right.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMI think I probably commented on this the first time. A black hole of any terrestrial size would evaporate and disappear well before it could do any damage. At least, that's the theory. I can appreciate the idea that, with a reality warper at one's disposal, no one sees the need to rely solely on theory to protect them. If they happen to be wrong and a black hole doesn't evaporate fast enough to prevent catastrophe, it would look a bit silly.
Based on my understanding, I agree. Reading between the lines, it's kind of trying to imply that Koizumi set this up so she could be part of something really big -- and it doesn't actually cost them anything to have a reality warper on hand, so why not? It's also, you know ... PR. >_>;
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMHaruhi and Koizumi have an apartment together. Haruhi goes to Hayate's house. Haruhi remarks on how tutoring allows her to keep feeling normal--it's a remarkable point that she wants to feel normal, one that isn't explored at that exact moment. Perhaps that's later?
In the extended epilogue, yeah.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PM"shifted it" -> "shifted them" or some other plural for agreement.
Oops!
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI didn't take money anymore, though; money was pretty meaningless to me by that point. I would have liked to have kept going to school, myself, but there wasn't much point. As Itsuki said, I really needed to focus on my powers more than anything else.
Point and point, though used in different senses. That might make it all right.
No, the first instance could be tense troubling, so I should revise that anyway. Oh, and another instance of 'point' just one paragraph up. I'll cut that out.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMHaruhi doesn't bother with school, preferring something more free form. This also means she's isolated from peers, which would strengthen Koizumi's hold over her, wouldn't it?
No.... She doesn't prefer something more free form -- she'd rather go to school again. But the rest, yeah, according to some plan or another.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuote"Ah?" he started, blinking. He recognized me and gave me the friendly smile that told me he hadn't learned to be afraid of what everyone knew I could do -- like his parents had. He was one of those rare people who saw me for me. Like--
Like Koizumi? No, like Kyon. Her guilt and positive view of him leak through despite what ideas about him Koizumi's poisoned her mind with.
So, that worked. :D
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteWell ... he might say such words, but I don't recall that he would ever use so much venom. I knew, of course, from what Hayate had said, but I felt somehow the question needed to be asked.
Would this be better with "I knew why"?
Wouldn't hurt, you're right.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMHaruhi is hesitant, yes, but there are a lot of ellipses here, and in the piece in general. While I'm not saying this is what you should do (because while I notice there are a lot of ellipses, they don't particularly bother me), you could do something like this:
Quote from: possible ellipsis trimming"People ... aren't toys, Nonoko. That was an accident," I told her gravely. "If you think I'm like that -- that I would intentionally do such a thing.... But even then, even if he deserved better...." I trailed off, and had to use Itsuki's words, when my own failed me: "He was plotting behind my back, you know. Itsuki told me that -- he once suggested that I was dangerous, and should be killed."
No, I tend to abuse my punctuation in the name of stylism. Those are good changes.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMAgain, I think it's very good, very telling that Haruhi can't express the belief that Kyon betrayed her in her own words and has to paraphrase Koizumi's flat and factual explanation. She accepts that Koizumi thinks this way and has taken it as fact even without feeling convinced of it on the inside, or that's how I read it.
That's what I was going for.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI just-- I never would have done a thing if he hadn't tried to move against me first! But.... What had I really hoped for, confronting her like that? Why would she insist that it wasn't true?
Is it "why would" or "why wouldn't"?
Why would, as far as I can tell.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMIn truth, I find the end of this scene a bit empty. Haruhi understands that she must win this argument with words, not force. She wants Nonoko's forgiveness, and confronting the girl with the truth is logical. If Nonoko can accept that Kyon did plot against Haruhi, then they can come to understanding.
But then, suddenly, Haruhi considers the possibility that Koizumi was wrong. The switch in thinking goes like this:
QuoteThis was a fight I needed to win with words, not force. But the truth.... The truth of it....
How long had I been trying to avoid thinking about this? How long had I just accepted what I was told, because it was easier than facing....
I feel like there's a vital component missing to Haruhi's thought process. It might be that I misinterpreted the "would she insist" part above, that Haruhi is genuinely surprised by Nonoko's unwavering belief in Kyon--but if so, it makes her estimation of Nonoko a lot more nuanced. What did Haruhi expect? That Kyon's sister was angry with her despite knowing how Kyon tried to betray her? And is there good reason to tell Nonoko about that betrayal at all at that point?
If I haven't misunderstood, then what it seems to me is that something about Nonoko says needs to strike a chord with Haruhi. Again, Nonoko's absolute, unwavering belief in Kyon is the key. Haruhi could convince herself that she used to feel the same way, which is why it's so difficult to argue because when she does, she has to use Koizumi's words. On an intellectual level, she can believe Kyon betrayed her, but not on an emotional one. I think this is what you intended to do; it just doesn't hit me because Haruhi changes her mind so fast, in my opinion. Personally, I can see Haruhi recalling how Koizumi dropped the ball on her and how she vehemently rejected it, only to accept it later because she couldn't stand the possibility she'd erased Kyon, Asahina, and Nagato for no reason at all. Nonoko's certainty here could remind Haruhi of her own back then.
There's another way to go about it instead, where Haruhi feels that doubt and then dismisses it, choosing instead to prove Nonoko wrong by seeing what happened for herself to give her argument all the more surety, but again, I don't think this is what you intended.
And, it could be this is all fine, and I'm just making too much of a small thing, so don't worry about it too much if what I say there doesn't resonate.
Hmmm.... What Haruhi wants is (and she knows it's not going to happen, deep down), to be forgiven. By Kyon, Yuki, and Mikuru, really -- since that's not an option, Nonoko makes the best surrogate possible.
I think the note about Nonoko's belief in Kyon is probably the best one to play up -- it does go back to the 'bond of trust' that even Koizumi aknowledged. Let's see what I can do about that.
Quote from: revisionThis was a fight I needed to win with words, not force. But her trust for Kyon.... That unshakable bond....
Before everything had fallen apart, _I_ trusted Kyon like that. Hadn't that been one of the very things that let us get close enough that she had called me a sister? What had happened to that bond? Well, Itsuki--
I couldn't just explain _that_ to her; the truth of 'John Smith' would have meant nothing to her. If I wanted to convince her, I had to find _real_ proof. I needed to confront Kyon's past betrayal head-on and see it for what it really was, not just try to avoid thinking about it. Only then could I find the evidence I needed.
By then, I had been pushed too far. I couldn't ... handle her presence any more -- not without having that confirmation, something to hold up against her own unwavering trust. I wouldn't do anything to hurt her, and I couldn't give in to the temptation to use my power to just change the past from where I was -- to make the problem go away.
Instead ... I broke in another direction.
I'm sorry, Itsuki.
I had to go back and look -- to find the truth.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI let the scene play forward again, intangible. Yuki herself walked right through me without reacting.
This briefly gives the impression the scene was intangible, but only briefly.
Huh. Will drop the 'intangable' word.
...nope, it just slipped through my fingers.
Changed ', intangible' to 'without interfering'.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMInteresting that even back then, Haruhi realized she had been in the wrong.
It is one of the most key moments of character growth....
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteBut that image of him ... that was more like the Kyon I remembered. He looked more haggard, angry at his situation, and upset about Itsuki pressuring him. And why wouldn't he?
Perhaps "why wouldn't he be"?
This one, I think I'll leave.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI didn't know what to feel -- after encountering Nonoko, then going back and making myself look at this.... I wanted someone to tell me that it was okay; to hold me and give me what I needed to somehow feel better -- to have everything somehow be okay. I couldn't run back to Itsuki, though -- not yet. No matter what I wanted ... I needed to find the truth.
Not sure what to do about this repetition.
It's actually foreshadowing, and a hint that Haruhi's power is escaping her control due to emotionality -- considering what happens next....
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteI didn't immediately recognize the woman in the room, staring at the costume rack with a sweet smile -- frozen, like all time was for the moment. She was dressed well enough, and looked like a very attractive young teacher. Something about her seemed familiar, and I studied the unknown for a while before resuming time. She would introduce herself to Kyon, wouldn't she?
I feel like this might be more natural if it were "unknown person"?
Alright.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuote"I swear to you," Mikuru said, her voice surprisingly gentle, sorrowfully sympathetic. "Suzumiya-san ... never have I done anything to act against you or Kyon -- everything I've ever done was to preserve the stability of the time-planes. Truthfully, I can't act here, in these times ... physically, I can't have any effect. Only through information can I provide any impact ... that's simply a limitation of classified--"
Kyon-kun?
Ah.... Hm. I think I'll leave it out here. The contrast works, since Mikuru (at that point) believes he's gone.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMSomething about this scene too seems incomplete; Haruhi doesn't press Asahina about how she survived. I'm not sure if, were I in her position, I would believe her--that Kyon and Nagato couldn't be saved--without knowing that detail. But, perhaps it's largely irrelevant.
Haruhi's not exactly on the top of her game; the subtext is she's looking for someone she can trust, and Mikuru, a supposed 'traitor' is higher on the list than Koizumi. The key point is Haruhi wishing Mikuru could somehow fix things.
I could probably work in a relatively minor revision to expand on this slightly if it's needed.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMQuoteShe paused for a moment, while he could still open one eye, the other already squinted shut against the pain, looking at him with an empty, regretful expression. It was hard for him to think straight, and he was sinking to the ground -- staying upright was too hard. There was smoke, faintly, the scent of--
I think the modifies get a bet jumbled here in the first sentence. Until we get to him it feels like Koizumi is looking, especially with the focus on Koizumi's eyes. Perhaps, instead of "looking", try "and looked".
Quote from: revisionShe paused for a moment, while he could still open one eye and look at her. The other was already squinted shut against the pain, but he was able to see her empty, regretful expression. It was hard for him to think straight, and he was sinking to the ground -- staying upright was too hard. There was smoke, faintly, the scent of--
Quote from: Muphrid on March 04, 2012, 07:46:40 PMI wonder why you chose to go back to third-person here. It seems to me that this scene could be done from Haruhi's perspective, with her scornfully realizing how pathetic his excuses are. Then again, I know that would be very, very intense.
But the main reason to use Koizumi's PoV was to underscore his 'ends justify the means'/'for the greater good' approach. Also, it's hard enough to see Haruhi, even this frayed and upset, being pushed enough to do what she did; I don't ... know if I could get into her PoV when she's doing something like that. So, yeah, 'intense'?
understatement
Whew. Thanks for the comments, Muphrid. I think you helped me strengthen quite a few weak points, and let me know that a lot of the core I wanted to get across ... did get across. Thanks again!
Sorry, a little off topic, but
QuoteHal and I need to have that character study discussion to expand on that.
If you do this in the chatroom could I maybe be able to sit in? I don't have mirc, but I think mibbit should do the job nicely as well (I've actually been meaning to get on for a while now, but work hours are probably counter to that idea). Er, anyways, the thought of something like this is keenly interesting to me, so barring being able to sit in perhaps a transcript posted to the forums?
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 10:03:10 PMRight. It would seem that in my attempts to befriend people by being helpful, I have managed to display myself as annoying and snarky. I sincerely apologize.
Sorry -- I get irked easily. Don't take it too personally; just think of it as a lesson learned.
You live, you learn ... that's life.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 10:03:10 PMYeah...
Don't use sarcasm. Got it. For some reason that seemed more like lightly witty in my head, but looking back...
I'm sorry. This REALLY wasn't my intention.
That was more being caustic than sarcastic, both of which are elements of snark.
Quote from: Gotonis on March 04, 2012, 10:03:10 PMRight now I'm just wondering how I can redeem myself. I see how far out of line my tone was, and I'll try not to do it again in the future.
Again, don't worry about it too much; these things happen. ...really, it seems annoying me has practically become a rite-of-passage to join the forums.
Anyway -- I do have a rage disorder which doesn't help things. Let's put that behind us and both attempt to be more constructive moving forward.
Quote from: Grahf on March 05, 2012, 01:50:43 AM
Sorry, a little off topic, but
QuoteHal and I need to have that character study discussion to expand on that.
If you do this in the chatroom could I maybe be able to sit in? I don't have mirc, but I think mibbit should do the job nicely as well (I've actually been meaning to get on for a while now, but work hours are probably counter to that idea). Er, anyways, the thought of something like this is keenly interesting to me, so barring being able to sit in perhaps a transcript posted to the forums?
Oh, no worries on that count. While you're welcome in IRC any time anyway (moar links to Asakura pictures! Yay!), we've kind of had that conversation so many times that Hal just started working on a document, which I'll contribute to shortly. Absolutely, it's going to be posted to the boards.
It was actually spawned by a discussion with Hal when he came up to visit, and we were hanging out with Dracos and explaining the lack of genuine details for Koizumi to work with.... Well, that was probably mentioned elsewhere, too. :p
Wild Act III C&C appears!
Quote from: Act IIIyour brother wouldn't want you to keep dwelling like this
I'd suggest dwelling
on this, myself.
Quote from: Act IIIsave for the presense of Suou Kuyou
Presence.
Quote from: Act III"Kuyou?" Sasaki asked, frowning.
A common theme, but first-name basis for Kuyou? Sasaki's notably formal in general, so I'd be expecting a Suou-san.
Quote from: Act IIIsignal to noise ratio approached infinity
Signal-to-noise.
Quote from: Act IIIInteraction with the intended target
Nitpicking technobabble is always fun. I'd suggest the initial target, rather than the intended one.
Quote from: Act IIIyou want Nonoko to be an ambassador to your kind, because her brother is gone?
Not sure this is a valid logical leap, even for Sasaki. That Kuyou wants to communicate with Nonoko, sure, but immediately connecting that to Kyon being gone seems a bit of a stretch.
Quote from: Act IIII was in a small, unused-looking cove, with no piers, just a long beach.
Comma after cove is unnecessary.
Quote from: Act IIIDistantly, but coming more loudly, as I was trying to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some small stringed instrument.
The phrase order in this is somewhat awkward. Suggestion:
As I was trying to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some small stringed instrument - distant, but growing louder by the moment.
Quote from: Act IIIas a voice ... _that_ voice ... sang....
Lots of ellipses; in this case, I'd just turn the last one into a period.
Quote from: Act IIISitting in the sea like an idiot in some strange afterlife, I couldn't think that his voice would sell a lot of music.
Another kind of awkward sentence. Suggestion:
Even in an afterlife as strange as this one, I was too stunned to think of anything - except that his voice would never sell a lot of music.
Quote from: Act IIIbefore hitting the wrong cord again
Chord.
Quote from: Act IIImore muscled than when I had known him
Minor point, but this implies some extra distance between the two of them. You might want to consider 'when I had last seen him' instead - although I can see this choice being intentional.
Quote from: Act IIII was in a clean bed, in a room with that, a small writing desk, and a dresser.
Somewhat awkward; suggestion:
I was in a clean bed, while the rest of the room was home to/contained/was occupied by a small writing desk and a dresser.
Quote from: Act IIII guess it's a guy's room?
Seems a bit non-sequitur; is there something about the furnishings that lead her to that? (i.e., the room is so plain and undecorated in general, etc.)
Quote from: Act IIIThere was the smell of pancakes, almost instantly, and the subdued sounds of someone working in a kitchen, murmuring in indistinct conversation with someone else.
More slightly awkward phrase order. Suggestion:
Almost immediately I was met with the smell of pancakes, accompanied by the subdued sounds...
Actually, this paragraph as a whole is a bit choppy, so more suggestions:
I was at one end of a hall on the upper story of a house, the stairs to one side, and doors lining the other wall, through which I glimpsed two other bedrooms. One was lined with bookshelves which had in turn been crammed to nearly overflowing with books, while the other was decorated with a few pictures and far fewer bookshelves -- I really only peeked into it for a moment, though.
Quote from: Act IIIdark green hair-band
Hairband.
Quote from: Act IIIthat I'd glanced across previously in confusion
This looks... odd? Perhaps 'glossed over' rather than 'glanced across', seems to be what you're getting at.
Quote from: Act IIIAs much as I wanted to hold onto him again
I'd suggest 'latch onto him'.
Quote from: Act IIIMaybe it was silly, but hadn't Mikuru told me that her confession -- and her affection -- for Kyon was genuine? But she hadn't actually acted on that?
I know you're trying to set up the distance to frame the conclusion a bit better, but this feels a little out of place here; Haruhi barely has any idea of what's happened yet, so her mind wandering into Mikuru and Kyon's relationship feels a bit out of place. I'd suggest either moving or lampshading it, although if you move it I'm not entirely sure where it'd fit better.
Quote from: Act IIIthough, Mikuru and Yuki were both looking at me.
Comma is not necessary here.
Quote from: Act IIIMikuru gave me a sympathetic smile, and began,
The first of these commas is also unnecessary, and I'd actually end this with a period before moving into Mikuru's dialogue. Latter is more a style preference than an actual correction, though.
Quote from: Act IIII had the power to reshape reality, myself, after all.
First comma is again extraneous.
Quote from: Act IIInormally ... use licenses would come down from.... Well, that doesn't matter anymore.
First ellipsis seems like it should be a comma here.
Quote from: Act IIIso reached for something inconsequential
I'd recommend 'so I reached' for a bit more clarity.
Quote from: Act IIIKyon's playing had broken off. He stared at the floor in dismay.
'dismay' seems like it might be too strong a word here - it's like it implies they actually tried to work something out and it failed, where I think your intent was more that they've both been avoiding the elephant in the room since they arrived. Maybe tone this down to something like an uncomfortable grimace or expression?
Quote from: Act III"I'm _older_ now ... and Kyon's younger, so...." She shrugs uncomfortably.
Mind thy tenses~!
Quote from: Act IIIMikuru started hesitantly, looking a bit embarassed
Embarrassed. Two doubles!
Quote from: Act IIIscratched the back of his head uncomfortably
Missing a period at the end of this sentence.
Quote from: Act IIITheir attention was drawn by you, Haruhi, initially, but
Can reorder this slightly to cut down on the comma overload:
'Their attention was initially drawn by you, Haruhi, but...'
Quote from: Act IIII am more a complete person,
Should be either 'I am a more complete person' or 'I am more of a complete person', to taste.
Quote from: Act III
Quote from: Act IIII am not the being that can't express myself
Contractions? From my Yuki? If you want to avoid repeating 'cannot', I'd use 'that is unable to express myself'.
Quote from: Act IIIAnd even if it's much weaker these days
Might just be a personal interpretation quibble, but describing data manipulation as 'weak' or 'strong' seems a little weird. Maybe 'more limited' instead?
Quote from: Act IIIhe admited with a cautious smile
Admitted.
Quote from: Act IIIthere was a hole where I used to be, here
The comma isn't needed.
Quote from: Act IIIIt's too strange to try and take back a place in that family, to me, though.
More slightly awkward order. I'd suggest: "For me, it's too strange to try to take back a place in that family, though."
Quote from: Act IIIthat little sister is doing well
Should be 'my little sister' - or else capitalize Little Sister/switch it out for Imouto.
Quote from: Act IIIWith one real exception, it's always been the right path for me.
Might suggest rephrasing a little, since he pretty much just found out how much of a jerkwad Koizumi really was. Perhaps "With one exception that's now apparent,"
Quote from: Act IIIWe have had several years to get used to this,
Seems to imply a different time flow. It's been three years for Haruhi (from Act II), which seems a bit short to be 'several'. Maybe just 'some years' or 'a few years'?
Quote from: Act IIIfound a way to escape that world is beyond pointless
High tense-ion moment.
Quote from: Act IIIWhat he was going to do in that world, well, it wasn't my problem, anymore.
I'd suggest replacing the first comma with an em-dash.
Quote from: Act IIINow that money isn't as tight --
Would replace this em-dash with a comma.
Quote from: Act IIII don't even have a high school diploma, either,
I'd drop 'even' and the first comma.
Quote from: Act IIIbut believe I can handle all of the paperwork
I'd add an 'I' for clarity - 'but I believe I can handle...'
Quote from: Act IIIYes, it's Spring, here, and the academic year starts in Fall
Names of seasons are not proper nouns, so don't need the capitalization. Bit of research shows this to be slightly ambiguous, but leans towards non-caps unless you're referencing a season in a specific year (like Fall 2011, etc.)
Quote from: Act IIIIf that's what you'd like Haruhi,
Should have a comma before Haruhi.
Quote from: Act IIII can't help but feel happier than I have in a long, long time. "That sounds almost perfect," I agree, while Kyon looks relieved.
And several tense corrections here.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMWild Act III C&C appears!
/me faints!
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIyour brother wouldn't want you to keep dwelling like this
I'd suggest dwelling on this, myself.
Standard rule applies; if I don't comment or reply, I use the suggestion.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMA common theme, but first-name basis for Kuyou? Sasaki's notably formal in general, so I'd be expecting a Suou-san.
Sure -- it's also been long enough that I think more formality than less is fine.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIyou want Nonoko to be an ambassador to your kind, because her brother is gone?
Not sure this is a valid logical leap, even for Sasaki. That Kuyou wants to communicate with Nonoko, sure, but immediately connecting that to Kyon being gone seems a bit of a stretch.
Dropped the final clause.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIDistantly, but coming more loudly, as I was trying to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some small stringed instrument.
The phrase order in this is somewhat awkward. Suggestion:
As I was trying to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some small stringed instrument - distant, but growing louder by the moment.
Quote from: revisionDistantly, as I tried to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some stringed instrument. I looked around for the source of the noise, wondering if maybe I could get some sort of explanation. While I tried to puzzle things out, it grew louder -- closer.
Then moved the last sentence of that paragraph to the first sentence of the next.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIISitting in the sea like an idiot in some strange afterlife, I couldn't think that his voice would sell a lot of music.
Another kind of awkward sentence. Suggestion:
Even in an afterlife as strange as this one, I was too stunned to think of anything - except that his voice would never sell a lot of music.
I'd already revised that while working on the previous suggestions. >_>;;
Quote from: revisionDespite that, sitting in the sea like an idiot in some strange afterlife, I couldn't think that his voice would sell a lot of music.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIImore muscled than when I had known him
Minor point, but this implies some extra distance between the two of them. You might want to consider 'when I had last seen him' instead - although I can see this choice being intentional.
Hmm.... Alright. I guess I can wait for the 'there's distance I hadn't realized' angle to be dropped later, when it's already being bridged. Kind of makes the later parts more poignant.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIII guess it's a guy's room?
Seems a bit non-sequitur; is there something about the furnishings that lead her to that? (i.e., the room is so plain and undecorated in general, etc.)
Haruhi: "Also, the magazines under the bed."
Kyon: "...Taniguchi lent those to me."
Haruhi: "Across a dimensional boundary!?"
Kyon: "His perversion knows no bounds! I wouldn't put it past him to hit on a gap youkai!"
Yukari-sama: "Incidentally, he's also danmakuproof. I could gap him into the sun, but that just makes everyone else less likely to protect it from hell-ravens. -_-"
Haruhi/Kyon: "...."
/me coughs.
Right-- Will revise that a bit.
Quote from: revisionI guess by the color scheme and lack of really feminine touches that it's a guy's room?
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIThere was the smell of pancakes, almost instantly, and the subdued sounds of someone working in a kitchen, murmuring in indistinct conversation with someone else.
More slightly awkward phrase order. Suggestion:
Almost immediately I was met with the smell of pancakes, accompanied by the subdued sounds...
Actually, this paragraph as a whole is a bit choppy, so more suggestions:
I was at one end of a hall on the upper story of a house, the stairs to one side, and doors lining the other wall, through which I glimpsed two other bedrooms. One was lined with bookshelves which had in turn been crammed to nearly overflowing with books, while the other was decorated with a few pictures and far fewer bookshelves -- I really only peeked into it for a moment, though.
A good suggestion, but too much your voice instead of mine. I'll take the suggestions and rework it a bit.
Quote from: revisionBefore anything else, I was hit with the smell of pancakes, and the subdued sounds of someone working in a kitchen, broken only by indistinct conversation. I could hear the voices, but not really make out what was being said. Pausing in the open doorway to get my bearings, I saw I was at one end of a hall on the upper story of a house, the stairs to one side, and doors lining the other wall.
From my vantage, I was able to see two other bedrooms. The nearer one was lined with bookshelves which had in turn been crammed to nearly overflowing with books. The other was decorated with a few pictures and far less bookshelves -- I really only peeked into it for a moment as I approached the top of the staircase.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIthat I'd glanced across previously in confusion
This looks... odd? Perhaps 'glossed over' rather than 'glanced across', seems to be what you're getting at.
Some repetition there as well....
Quote from: revisionNot the Yuki of my journeys back through time and strange memories -- a slightly older Yuki, with her hair grown out a little, kept in place with a dark green hairband. The one from the picture upstairs -- and here I realized what was changed about her, that I'd missed previously in confusion. She was wearing glasses again, and her clothing was different, too, more casual than I remembered her typically wearing. Her outfit was a simple pair of khaki shorts and a loose Hawaiian shirt.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIMaybe it was silly, but hadn't Mikuru told me that her confession -- and her affection -- for Kyon was genuine? But she hadn't actually acted on that?
I know you're trying to set up the distance to frame the conclusion a bit better, but this feels a little out of place here; Haruhi barely has any idea of what's happened yet, so her mind wandering into Mikuru and Kyon's relationship feels a bit out of place. I'd suggest either moving or lampshading it, although if you move it I'm not entirely sure where it'd fit better.
Hum. Lampshading is the way to go ... but that spells out Haruhi's interested in a romance, which is a bit soon for this point in the story.
Yeah ... I'll just adress is in the epilogue, and drop it here.
Quote from: revisionI wasn't clear on _exactly_ what was going on ... but I knew I woke up in Kyon's bedroom. If Yuki had the books, then ... that made the other bedroom Mikuru's. So obviously, they were living together. They'd made a life together, here, somehow....
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIMikuru gave me a sympathetic smile, and began,
The first of these commas is also unnecessary, and I'd actually end this with a period before moving into Mikuru's dialogue. Latter is more a style preference than an actual correction, though.
A period feels stiff there; went with a colon.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIKyon's playing had broken off. He stared at the floor in dismay.
'dismay' seems like it might be too strong a word here - it's like it implies they actually tried to work something out and it failed, where I think your intent was more that they've both been avoiding the elephant in the room since they arrived. Maybe tone this down to something like an uncomfortable grimace or expression?
Grimace seems worse. I'll go with simple evasion.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIITheir attention was drawn by you, Haruhi, initially, but
Can reorder this slightly to cut down on the comma overload:
'Their attention was initially drawn by you, Haruhi, but...'
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIII am not the being that can't express myself
Contractions? From my Yuki? If you want to avoid repeating 'cannot', I'd use 'that is unable to express myself'.
I think this Yuki would be capable, but consistency.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIAnd even if it's much weaker these days
Might just be a personal interpretation quibble, but describing data manipulation as 'weak' or 'strong' seems a little weird. Maybe 'more limited' instead?
I'm going to disagree with this one only because it's Kyon speaking. I agree with you in principle, though.
....okay, it looks terrible, I'll change it.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIthat little sister is doing well
Should be 'my little sister' - or else capitalize Little Sister/switch it out for Imouto.
Was supposed to be 'that little sister' not ... erg. Need to revise, for certain.
Quote from: revisionWell, I like to hear that they're okay anyway -- especially that other little sister.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIWe have had several years to get used to this,
Seems to imply a different time flow. It's been three years for Haruhi (from Act II), which seems a bit short to be 'several'. Maybe just 'some years' or 'a few years'?
I'll say the specific 'three,' actually.
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMQuote from: Act IIIWhat he was going to do in that world, well, it wasn't my problem, anymore.
I'd suggest replacing the first comma with an em-dash.
Used a lot in that paragraph; went with ellipses for variety.
Whew -- thanks a ton for the comments, as always. :D
Edit:
Quote from: Halbarad on March 05, 2012, 08:56:30 PMEven in an afterlife as strange as this one, I was too stunned to think of anything - except that his voice would never sell a lot of music.
Evidently my revision didn't work. I don't understand what the issue is, so I'm just using your suggestion, since that's easier than trying to understand the specifics in this instance.
QuoteNever-mind -- she'd had misfires before, rare as they might be. Considering what she was trying....
Just looking at agreement; perhaps "may have been"?
QuoteWithin her apartment, her college homework set aside for the moment, Sasaki consoled the smaller girl collapsed on her knees before her, sobbing about the earlier confrontation with the world's legendary 'Witch of Miracles.'
It feels like this might run together a bit. Perhaps "smaller girl, who'd collapsed"?
Quote"Opposing factions caused significant entropy; signal to noise ratio approached infinity. Communication would have been impossible -- save for retro-temporal instruction sets. Interaction with the intended target has fallen below acceptable probability threshold.
If the signal to noise ratio were infinity, there would be infinite signal and no noise? Zero would be more appropriate, I think, even if it doesn't sound as exotic.
Kuyou appears to Sasaki and Nonoko, and we learn that Haruhi is really gone. The function of this scene seems more practical than anything. All we get from it is a confirmation that Haruhi is really nowhere in reality, which the opening scene stated already. If this scene is referenced later on (say, in the epilogue), that's one thing, but right now, it just feels like, ah, Nonoko got to do something cool after all and that's good, but it's also just kind of huh, interesting.
QuoteI opened my eyes and clawed to the surface, choking and sputtering for breath, feeling like an idiot to realize I'd collapsed into water barely any deeper than my head.
This was what I had sent Kyon to? I cast about in confusion, wiping water from my eyes as I realized that I was treading water in the ocean, a few dozen meters from a shoreline.
Heh, Haruhi nearly drowns in the shallows, but realize and realize here.
QuoteDistantly, but coming more loudly, as I was trying to make sense of this situation, I heard the plucking of some small stringed instrument. I looked around for the source of the noise, wondering if maybe I could get some sort of explanation. From the sea, with the sun behind me, I was probably invisible to anyone else.
I didn't think of that at the time, though. While I searched, a figure came down the path, an instrument of some kind held in both hands as a voice ... that voice ... sang....
He couldn't sing before ... not very well. He'd gotten better at it -- unbelievably better, even in English. Sitting in the sea like an idiot in some strange afterlife, I couldn't think that his voice would sell a lot of music.
Just so you know about this repetition.
QuoteThat was as far as he got before hitting the wrong cord again, breaking off with a sigh and a displeased sound.
Chord.
QuoteAll I knew was that I had to apologize ... to tell him how sorry I was-- To start to explain everything.... But when I opened my mouth, the only thing I could find to blurt out was, "You got tanned!" Like an idiot. I had a single special chance to talk to Kyon, and that was the first thing I said.
"You got tanned!" Priceless.
I do like how Haruhi feels like she's been kicked in the gut when Kyon calls her
Suzumiya briefly.
QuoteThere was the smell of pancakes, almost instantly, and the subdued sounds of someone working in a kitchen, murmuring in indistinct conversation with someone else. I was at one end of a hall on the upper story of a house, the stairs to one side, and doors lining the other wall. I glimpsed two other bedrooms. One was lined with bookshelves which had in turn been crammed to nearly overflowing with books. The other was decorated with a few pictures and far less bookshelves -- I really only peeked into it for a moment, though.
less bookshelves -> fewer?
QuoteIt was quiet for a moment, only the footsteps from the kitchen breaking it as Mikuru -- the older one, again, came in with another platter, this one loaded with eggs and sausage. "Su-- Ah, no.... Haruhi," the woman said, before she set it down and took her own seat, "ah ... I'm sorry if this alarms you, so brace yourself, alright?"
"breaking it" -> "breaking the silence"?
QuoteThere was so much to ask.... I couldn't think of where to begin yet, so reached for something inconsequential until I could settle down. "So ... um ... what do you do, Kyon? Are you a performer?" I wondered.
So I reached.
Quote"With the data of two incomplete or damaged versions of myself, I am more a complete person," Yuki explained. "At least, that is how I feel. I am not the being that can't express myself, nor the one that cannot hold her emotions in check. And for both of the sets of memories that comprise my being now ... he is still my friend -- and I am no longer lonely."
"myself" -> "herself"
In general, I think, hm, that's awfully convenient, that there was no "complete" Nagato here to override or replace. It avoids the moral problem of replacing her pretty neatly--perhaps too neatly, but I'd be hard-pressed to say there's a better way to go about it.
Quote"Well, for me it's ... difficult, since she's not you," he admits with a cautious smile. "Ah-- We e-mail, still, since she insists on staying in touch ... she gave me a picture with her hair up, and told me to think of it as you....
admits -> admitted (tense)
Quote"Anyway, mostly she tells me what the copies of my family do -- since ... there was no original 'me' of this world. I was just moved over from the original universe when this one was made, so when I got back, there was a hole where I used to be, here.
When he got back to that Japan? It's somewhat unclear to me.
Quote"It's too strange to try and take back a place in that family, to me, though. I didn't even let them know I was here, since I'm not ... really ... the person they think I am. That's a big part of why we came here. I don't like that to them, someone vanished one day without any explanation and was never seen again.... But I think it might be even more difficult trying to explain everything. Well, I like to hear that they're okay anyway, and that little sister is doing well."
"I don't like to
do that to them" or "I don't like doing that to them"
QuoteAfter I finished explaining the entire story, I looked around the people who had offered me so much support and sympathy so far. Yuki was still hugging me, and I'd be lying if I said that seeing her alive like that wasn't just as wonderful as seeing Kyon again. Mikuru was still holding one of my hands and offering the occasional soft pat.
Just pointing out this repetition as well.
Koizumi gets a reprieve; all for the best, since it could leave a bad taste in one's mouth to leave him burning for eternity. Kyon seems to have a good reason for not wanting to go back to the original world, but I feel it's tainted by the argument that history records it that way, so that's what they should do. Even if Asahina knows it to be true (and the part about Koizumi ultimately being all right can stand), I don't think that information really helps for that one point. It skirts toward "because history told me so" territory, despite the other valid reasons they have for not going back.
The one other thing I do feel is how Kyon's family (particularly Nonoko) is left in the dark for this decision, and I'm not sure what can be done about that. Tying into my other concern, about the Nonoko scene at the beginning, perhaps she can find out in some way that Kyon is alive after all? A general reconciliation? I'm not sure where it would fit, though, or if that's even the best choice...
I'll save some more comprehensive comments about the piece for after the epilogue.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuoteNever-mind -- she'd had misfires before, rare as they might be. Considering what she was trying....
Just looking at agreement; perhaps "may have been"?
Right. As always, if I don't reply to a comment, it's because I used it.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuote"Opposing factions caused significant entropy; signal to noise ratio approached infinity. Communication would have been impossible -- save for retro-temporal instruction sets. Interaction with the intended target has fallen below acceptable probability threshold.
If the signal to noise ratio were infinity, there would be infinite signal and no noise? Zero would be more appropriate, I think, even if it doesn't sound as exotic.
You know, I never thought about the fact that the phrase is hard-coded that way? You're right. 'approached insignificance'. Wait, that's got the wrong connotation, too. Curses.... Yeah, zero.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMKuyou appears to Sasaki and Nonoko, and we learn that Haruhi is really gone. The function of this scene seems more practical than anything. All we get from it is a confirmation that Haruhi is really nowhere in reality, which the opening scene stated already. If this scene is referenced later on (say, in the epilogue), that's one thing, but right now, it just feels like, ah, Nonoko got to do something cool after all and that's good, but it's also just kind of huh, interesting.
Well, part of the point was to state that despite Koizumi's expectations and plans, the world goes on without Haruhi -- and humanity gets allies in the form of the SCD.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuoteI opened my eyes and clawed to the surface, choking and sputtering for breath, feeling like an idiot to realize I'd collapsed into water barely any deeper than my head.
This was what I had sent Kyon to? I cast about in confusion, wiping water from my eyes as I realized that I was treading water in the ocean, a few dozen meters from a shoreline.
Heh, Haruhi nearly drowns in the shallows, but realize and realize here.
Second instance to 'discovered.'
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMI do like how Haruhi feels like she's been kicked in the gut when Kyon calls her Suzumiya briefly.
He'll make it up to her. <_<;
Promise! >_>;;
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuoteIt was quiet for a moment, only the footsteps from the kitchen breaking it as Mikuru -- the older one, again, came in with another platter, this one loaded with eggs and sausage. "Su-- Ah, no.... Haruhi," the woman said, before she set it down and took her own seat, "ah ... I'm sorry if this alarms you, so brace yourself, alright?"
"breaking it" -> "breaking the silence"?
Too repetitive; changed to 'sounding'.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuote"With the data of two incomplete or damaged versions of myself, I am more a complete person," Yuki explained. "At least, that is how I feel. I am not the being that can't express myself, nor the one that cannot hold her emotions in check. And for both of the sets of memories that comprise my being now ... he is still my friend -- and I am no longer lonely."
"myself" -> "herself"
Eh, that ... doesn't feel quite right to me. Oh, wait, you meant the second instance. Yeah, that flows.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMIn general, I think, hm, that's awfully convenient, that there was no "complete" Nagato here to override or replace. It avoids the moral problem of replacing her pretty neatly--perhaps too neatly, but I'd be hard-pressed to say there's a better way to go about it.
Yuki: "Almost as though it were planned that way."
I'm actually okay with that aspect. It gives good closure to the Disappearance arc, IMO. >_>;;
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuote"Anyway, mostly she tells me what the copies of my family do -- since ... there was no original 'me' of this world. I was just moved over from the original universe when this one was made, so when I got back, there was a hole where I used to be, here.
When he got back to that Japan? It's somewhat unclear to me.
Yeah, I'll change 'back' to 'this world'.
Quote from: revision"Anyway, mostly she tells me what the copies of my family do -- since ... there was no original 'me' of this world. I was just moved over from the original universe when this one was made. Basically, when I got back to the original world from this one, there was a hole in this world where I used to be.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMQuote"It's too strange to try and take back a place in that family, to me, though. I didn't even let them know I was here, since I'm not ... really ... the person they think I am. That's a big part of why we came here. I don't like that to them, someone vanished one day without any explanation and was never seen again.... But I think it might be even more difficult trying to explain everything. Well, I like to hear that they're okay anyway, and that little sister is doing well."
"I don't like to do that to them" or "I don't like doing that to them"
O_o?
I think you misunderstood. But I can be clearer:
Quote from: revisionI don't like that, in their eyes, someone vanished one day without any explanation and was never seen again....
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMKoizumi gets a reprieve; all for the best, since it could leave a bad taste in one's mouth to leave him burning for eternity. Kyon seems to have a good reason for not wanting to go back to the original world, but I feel it's tainted by the argument that history records it that way, so that's what they should do. Even if Asahina knows it to be true (and the part about Koizumi ultimately being all right can stand), I don't think that information really helps for that one point. It skirts toward "because history told me so" territory, despite the other valid reasons they have for not going back.
I think I'm actually okay with that, though -- while their actions are ruled with the iron fist of predetermination in the original world, in their own copy, they can do as they wish. I guess ... actually, I can bring that into the story, as well. Yeah, that might make a good contrast; Yuki doesn't have to deal with the IDSE and cross-temporal synching (or other interfaces going stab-crazy toward Kyon), Mikuru doesn't have to deal with predetermination (anymore), and Kyon ... gets to enjoy that with them? Haruhi, certainly, gets enough freedom to make her own choices and do what she likes.
So revised a stretch; looks like it ties in pretty neatly:
Quote from: revisionI wasn't sure what to make of that. If Suou had powers, maybe she would take care of it? But ... that doesn't make _me_ feel less responsible. "I don't.... I don't like that our choices are made for us by things like that," I finally muttered.
"In that world," Mikuru agreed. "But this world is invisible, unknown to everyone from the world we came from-- So it doesn't have any bearing on this one, does it?"
"There are more freedoms, and fewer restrictions," Yuki added quietly.
When they said that, I supposed that they were right. I could ignore the problem, and probably someone else would take care of it. Or....
Okay ... I'd done enough on that count. I didn't really care to think of it in the terms that Koizumi taught me, but bearing a grudge against him when I'd found a way to escape that world was beyond pointless. I thought about it and focused -- he didn't deserve an eternal punishment. I wasn't ... sure how quickly it would work, given the separation of our timelines. But he didn't deserve to either live forever, or suffer.
I wondered ... I supposed that was my actual final interaction with that world -- I wanted my power to stop, and restore him to the state of before I had tried to hurt him. What he was going to do in that world ... well, it wasn't my problem, anymore. He was free to do it without my interference -- or help.
There was a possibility that he might suffer for a _little_ before the power worked on him, but I didn't want to risk meddling further. That was it, then-- If I was really welcome to stay here....
"Okay," I said quietly, managing a tremulous smile. "U...um.... But then, after that, I'm not ... sure what to do, anymore."
"Whatever you wish," Yuki replied. "Like us, your vocation until this point has been decided for you. Now, you may choose new futures on your own."
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMThe one other thing I do feel is how Kyon's family (particularly Nonoko) is left in the dark for this decision, and I'm not sure what can be done about that. Tying into my other concern, about the Nonoko scene at the beginning, perhaps she can find out in some way that Kyon is alive after all? A general reconciliation? I'm not sure where it would fit, though, or if that's even the best choice...
I'm not sure. If there's enough call, I can probably have a surprise, 'no one can know this happened, but we came to tell you...' moment between Space Ambassador Nonoko and Haruhi/Kyon, but I think Kyon covers it pretty well in his comment that, "It's not great, but it could absolutely be worse."
Quote from: Muphrid on March 06, 2012, 11:43:06 PMI'll save some more comprehensive comments about the piece for after the epilogue.
Alright -- and thanks again for the comments. :)
Epilogue:
Haruhi notes how Kyon most of all has and does treat her as a person instead of a powerful being, and this leads into how she and Asahina agreed to both enter relationships with Kyon in a mutually amicable way, one that Nagato feels no need to enter. Haruhi says several times how it was embarrassing and awkward, but she seems happy with the final result.
QuoteYuki with a more obvious sense of humor was a bit strange, but easy to get along with -- and a good friend. She helped Kyon and I study, which brought me back to where we were -- graduation.
Optional grammar suggestion: "Kyon and me" since they're objects and not subjects.
Also: possibly "which brings" since it's more about the narrative being brought there in the current time, not Haruhi being brought in the past time?
Description of the graduation ceremony, who's in the crowd and such.
QuoteMy degree was in education, and Kyon's was in linguistics. For all his claims not to be a genius, he picked up language and communication skills amazingly well, so pretty much took the 'easy route.' I wasn't sure where I wanted to go with my studies at first, but I enojyed school. And thinking back to the world we left behind ... I had enjoyed teaching, too.
Possibly, "so
he pretty much took"?
Haruhi says she enjoys school and teaching, leading to...
QuoteMikuru certainly seemed to be happy with her role, teaching college students. Somewhere, there was the idea that with the four of us, if Yuki was willing to handle accreditation, could probably start a very small private school for bilingual students. It's something I would be able to bring up later, so there was no reason to bring it up during the graduation ceremony.
I think if you do the strike above, the sentence might feel more natural? Also, repetition underlined.
The ceremony concludes, and Haruhi reflects on how in Hawaii, they can show physical affection more and not be judged for it.
QuoteAfter joining some classmates and heading out for drinks, we decided to call it an early night. None of us were that big on getting drunk, and we wanted to have a slightly more private celebration between us. I was a bit tipsy, but not much. Mikuru had less than me and was even wobblier on her feed, but none of us were interested in getting any more intoxicated than that.
That's probably already been pointed out.
Haruhi expounds on the school idea, garnering support and agreement. I think it's good to see what the future would hold for this group, so overall, I enjoyed this epilogue.
Now, for the story in general, I remember feeling that the third act tied things up neatly--perhaps too neatly. Let me see--it kind of goes like this, right? By the end of the first act, things go to hell. The second act is Haruhi slowly but surely questioning how Koizumi has indoctrinated her and breaking free of him. The third is her time to heal back from the damage he's done to her, made in large part much easier considering she never did anything wrong at all.
I feel like the first act is a little weak because Koizumi's sinister intent doesn't become clear until right near the end--when he starts his false confession of identity to Haruhi. That may be a personal preference, but I think some aura of anxiety or anticipation might help make the ultimate direction clear and give the reader a better expectation. As an example: a scene right after where Kyon tells Koizumi about the trump card, Koizumi could meet with the IDSE and other time travelers, make his true philosophy on what needs to be done with Haruhi known, and there we go. Maybe that's all too explicit or too fast, though. If so, feel free to ignore it.
I feel act two is very, very strong, and my remarks earlier about POV were merely, "Hm, what if it were this way, that could be interesting." As it is, making Koizumi come across as the well-intentioned (...ish) extremist that he is for that scene and seeing into his head for a while (since he
has driven a lot of the story, even without a lot of screentime) is worthwhile.
Act three, then--my only concerns here are, again, that Haruhi never did anything wrong, so I feel like it undercuts the lessons she learned or the guilt she felt. That said, seeing this act as a piece on Haruhi healing, on learning to be herself again and not the rigidly contained person Koizumi had tried to make her into, may be enough. In fact, the more I think about it that way, the more I like it and feel like this is adequate as it stands.
From what I remember, it doesn't feel like you made too many changes to this piece, but what you did alter seems to have tightened it up and addressed any lingering logic problems. Good story.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMEpilogue:
Haruhi notes how Kyon most of all has and does treat her as a person instead of a powerful being, and this leads into how she and Asahina agreed to both enter relationships with Kyon in a mutually amicable way, one that Nagato feels no need to enter. Haruhi says several times how it was embarrassing and awkward, but she seems happy with the final result.
The part about Kyon treating Haruhi as a real human instead of trying to force her to be something better was a critical element for me, in this story. :x
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMQuoteYuki with a more obvious sense of humor was a bit strange, but easy to get along with -- and a good friend. She helped Kyon and I study, which brought me back to where we were -- graduation.
Optional grammar suggestion: "Kyon and me" since they're objects and not subjects.
Also: possibly "which brings" since it's more about the narrative being brought there in the current time, not Haruhi being brought in the past time?
Not sure about the tense mixing there.... But alright. Let's see how that scans.
I dunno. I guess it works, sure. Let's go with that. Alright; if I don't comment otherwise, it's because I used the suggestion.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMQuoteMikuru certainly seemed to be happy with her role, teaching college students. Somewhere, there was the idea that with the four of us, if Yuki was willing to handle accreditation, could probably start a very small private school for bilingual students. It's something I would be able to bring up later, so there was no reason to bring it up during the graduation ceremony.
I think if you do the strike above, the sentence might feel more natural? Also, repetition underlined.
Second instance to 'mention it'.
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMI feel like the first act is a little weak because Koizumi's sinister intent doesn't become clear until right near the end--when he starts his false confession of identity to Haruhi. That may be a personal preference, but I think some aura of anxiety or anticipation might help make the ultimate direction clear and give the reader a better expectation. As an example: a scene right after where Kyon tells Koizumi about the trump card, Koizumi could meet with the IDSE and other time travelers, make his true philosophy on what needs to be done with Haruhi known, and there we go. Maybe that's all too explicit or too fast, though. If so, feel free to ignore it.
Well, the risk there is that I have (quite frequently, the last time I dared to look at the reviews for this fic) already been labeled enough of a Koizumi-basher. While I don't like the guy, and I do aknowledge my biases, I also try and work around them. :X
I'm not sure about the suggested scene; I like the reveal where the reader gets to put two-and-two together on what Koizumi's telling Haruhi (which is also spelled out in Act II).
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMAct three, then--my only concerns here are, again, that Haruhi never did anything wrong, so I feel like it undercuts the lessons she learned or the guilt she felt. That said, seeing this act as a piece on Haruhi healing, on learning to be herself again and not the rigidly contained person Koizumi had tried to make her into, may be enough. In fact, the more I think about it that way, the more I like it and feel like this is adequate as it stands.
Yeah ... I'm mostly happy with it. Haruhi does suffer (agonize) a lot for things that aren't actually her fault, but that's totally Koizumi's 'for the greater good' approach in action. I needed to have her make a genuine mistake to make up for, and that was consigning Koizumi to suffer. It was always intended (even in the original draft) that Koizumi wouldn't actually burn forever, but I wasn't sure how to bring that into Act III.
Putting in the epilogue gets a chance to offset the 'going back to that point' aspect of Act III, but that point needed to be specifically spelled out since it seems to have grated on a lot of nerves. The implications of Haruhi fixing it later after she calmed down, or leaving it to Kuyou to take care of didn't seem strong enough....
Quote from: Muphrid on March 09, 2012, 04:02:29 PMFrom what I remember, it doesn't feel like you made too many changes to this piece, but what you did alter seems to have tightened it up and addressed any lingering logic problems. Good story.
Glad it worked; I was pretty satisfied with the general story structure, so....
Anyway, thanks again for the detailed feedback! :)