Fate/Stay Night Info (http://animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=5394)
Tracking Thread (http://www.soulriders.org/forum/index.php?topic=2204.0)
Review Thread (http://www.soulriders.org/forum/index.php?topic=2821.0)
Discuss the series here.
Sincerely,
Shuten
Huh, this has finally gotten started?
Neat.
Dracos
Is it just me or does the protagonist look a bit younger (and kind of dinky) in the preview?
Not exactly Dracos.
A promo dvd was released with two trailers for the series. The series itself will not start until January.
Sincerely,
Shuten
Oh, well then see this in january :)
Dracos
Any word on who is planning on doing this series yet?
Just saw the raw. It looked pretty nice so far. Not the greatest animation, but more than enough to get the job done. Consistant. Voice talents were superior. Took all of one sentence from Sakura for her voice to stick in my mind. Loved her as Ururu. Archer sounds pretty awesome, too. Junichi Suwabe has played some badass roles in his time (Fuuma from X, Katana from Gad Guard being my favs) and he just nails the character.
The opening music was good, just a remixed version of This Illusion. Its softer than the version I'm used to hearing, but it is more full as well. I still perfer the original version, but this one might grow on me.
I really liked the closing music. I don't recall that one from the game OSTs so maybe its new? Definately want the single when it comes out.
So far it looks like they're going to watch the pacing a lot more closely than Tsukihime did, thankfully. There is still humor in this one. From the raw I'm fairly certain this is going to be one to watch this season.
It is looking good so far, and I'm glad for that. I loved Fuji-nee's portrayal, and the voice acting is, as you said, superior all around. Issei's voice I find a tad too deep for a high schooler though, but I guess they were trying to maintain the serious/mature tone of the guy that way.
I found the remix's name cute too. As opposed to "This Illusion", it's "Disillusion". Cute. =)
I kind of wish there was a bit more in the ending sequence than Saber standing looking noble as her dress billows in the wind, but the song was decent. I doubt I liked it as much as you.
What I'm really interested in seeing is which direction the series heads in terms of the game. Will it follow any particular scenario, a fusion of two of them, a fusion of all three, diverge off scenarios, or just be it's own scenarion altogether?
Shu and I've mentioned our choices in IRC the other day, with me wanting a Fate/UBW scenario fusion, and him wanting a UBW/HF fusion.
I boo on evil Sakura though from Heaven's Feel! ^_^;;;
I'm hoping for an original path, but with some evil Sakura worked in there. That voice gone evil would just be win all over. >_>
I hope Rider gets more love than certain scenarios would allow her.
Again...Boo on evil Sakura! ^_^
Just saw Eclipse's sub of ep 1. Pretty much what I got from the raw, though now I got to see the character's personalities shine through their voices, and shine they did, all of 'em.
Archer and Fujimura were particularly great of the bunch. I'm almost certain they're going to stay my favorite male and female characters of the show (at least unless Fuji-nee stops getting screentime once the war really gets underway).
Anybody know how long the series is scheduled for yet? I'm hoping for at least 26 episodes, and not the 12 episodes treatment that Tsukihime got.
From what I've been able to gather it looks to be a 24-26 episode series. Rumors say its two seasons (26 episodes). Other rumors say it'll be released on 8 DVDs in R2 (roughly 24-26 episodes).
Anime News Network lists it at 24 episodes. So do a few japanese stuff online shops that I've looked around. Not bad. Hopefully it won't suffer from overdone recap episodes or flashback sequences of past episodes.
Anyhoo, ep 2 is out raw (Yay Shu for sending!). Nice episode, we finally start getting into the war and see some servant battle action. And as was expected by pretty much everyone, Saber makes her appearance at the very end of the episode. Yay. ^^
Man, the animation quality dropped quick. >_>;
Still, its good enough for me. Let's hope it doesn't slide any further. Saber looked awesome. Not muchelse to say until I see the episode subbed.
animation quality -always- drops after 1st episodes. ^_^
Quoteanimation quality -always- drops after 1st episodes
Not that the quality was all that great in the first place. I wished they'd just splurge more on the budget for the action scenes. I'd prefer a 13 ep-high-Hi-Q series than a mediocre 24-26 ep freebiee. Quality before quantity and all. -_-
Mmm...I kinda disagree with the quality before quantity statement. While quality -is- important, less episodes doesn't always result in better quality. Art might go up, but plot often goes way down.
13 episodes tends to smush a lot of information together, with no care for pacing. While yes, some pacing annoys the living crap out of me (Noir), no pacing is worse (Tales of Phantasia and various animes of 13 eps or less).
Fate Stay Night has a lot of material to cover in even a single scenario and they already crammed a lot of little FSN tidbits into ep 1 right off the bat really. Hopefully the quality of animation won't go down a lot more though. I was somewhat dissapointed in Lancer vs Archer in ep 2 as well.
Mm. Episode 3. Nice fight scene they got there. It's now quite clear what scenario they're following and what character's gonna get shafted on screen time...
The episodes feel short to me, for some reason. We'll see how it goes.
Bleh. I might not get to watching this until summer x-x.
Dracos
Quote from: "Sir Alex"Mm. Episode 3. Nice fight scene they got there. It's now quite clear what scenario they're following and what character's gonna get shafted on screen time...
The episodes feel short to me, for some reason. We'll see how it goes.
I wouldn't quite go as far as to say they're definitely following a specific scenario just yet. If there's one thing Shuffle, best example I can think of, showed us is that it is possible to merge several relatively standalone and for the most part seperate scenarios, in the game after you reach a point with each girl there's very little interaction with anyone but 'said' girl, into one cohesive whole.
If the people using a vastly inferior product as their source can merge it into a whole that exceeds the sums of it's seperate parts I see no reason that the people working with vastly superior, in my opinion, material can't pull off something similar in the end. In essence it's just far too early to know.
Sincerely,
Shuten
Watched through 4 now. Mmm, I'm liking it. Could do with more action and all, and well... the whole skittering around saying things with any confidence is bleh. It's not really seizing me on that front...
That said, the overall plot is interesting enough to continue and the swordfights are always fun =D
Dracos
Just saw the raw of 8.
The first half is pretty boring without being able to understand Japanese. The second half, however, is pure harem goodness.
Also, next week it looks like a double dose of action.
Saber Vs Assassin!
Rider Vs Caster!
One ladder!
One steel cage!
No way out!
... Or something to that effect. >_>
I've watched through seven and I basically see the show as neat...but with the standing problem that they really don't seem to have a grasp of Shirou's character. Is he a human that'll rely on Saber? A hero? Something inbetween? They're not really sure as one minute he's showing his resolve to work as a team and win at any cost and the next he's leaving saber behind at home and the next he's...
The whole set of 'paradox' they laid out is more a problem of them not deciding to let him have some resolved decision one way or another than anything else.
Dracos
Seen episode 11 yet, Drac? I should hope that would better define his character in your eyes.
The funny thing about Shirou is that he really seems to have a different idea of what a Hero of Justice is supposed to be like. It looked more like he wanted to be a mediator kind of person, saving physical confrontations for the absolute last resort. And then, bang, he's sudden;y thrust into a situation where he's supposed to help kill people, which goes against the grain of his beliefs. Go back and rewatch the church scene. He doesn't even want to get involved in the war until its revealed what the wrong person touching the grail might do. He doesn't seem interested in the grail at all.
I think a big part of the show is the differences between what he percikeves to be the path of justice and what rather harsher reality of the situation he finds himself in.
I like the guy, but maybe its just me. I mean, he's almost universally hated as a main character by the Fate TV fanbase. I really don't understand why, though. What were they expecting from this series?
Feh, my problems with the Fate fanbase are an entirely different post. >_>
I've watched through that and it was a neat episode but it seems more like his character changes pretty much every episode, almost as if different people are writing him.
I'm also not too keen on the setup so far if only because it's not feeling like a war. Too many of the folks feel 'happy/nice'. Yeah, the fights going on but it's not feeling like a competition at all. Maybe it's the focus on Shirou. Maybe it's the deliberate sympathizing of half the known masters and the complete obscuring of the others outside of servants showing up. We're not getting a glimpse of non-shirou related fights going on to flesh out the sense of 'this is a war for the grail and not everyone focuses on shirou'.
Shirou goes very strongly between resolved and wishy-washy. If he was a resiliant pacifist, he'd be more identifiable. If he stuck with his early show resolution, he'd be pretty identifiable as well. I think it is that he(and the other characters perception of him) waver so often that gets anger going his direction. I like resolved shirou. I don't mind mostly pacifist shirou. The switching from the first to the second irritates me. It's one thing to go from the second to the first, but he's been regularly going back and that just doesn't work. You don't 'decide to do whatever it takes' and then decide 'I don't really want to fight', but that's the perception he delivers off. Him going pacifist for Archer to yell at him about earlier just didn't jive.
If he stays in the resolved sense, he'll be easy enough to enjoy as a main, but if he switches back AGAIN it's just 'meh'.
Dracos
I agree about the war. They really do need to play that up some more.
The next episode preview makes me hopeful that they've finally gotten out all of the exposition they needed to get out of the way. I cannot help but note that Type-Moon's previous series, Tsukihime, was said to suffer from just the opposite. The fans complained that too much was left out of the series. Now they have all the exposition and they complain about too much time being wasted explaining the set up.
Be careful what you wish for, indeed.
I don't have the same problem with the pacing that they do. Half and episode of exposition and half an episode of plot moving forward is perfectly fine for the early episodes in this kind of show. Now that the action has started and the explainations are (hopefully) out of the way I expect the series to pick up speed fairly rapidly.
I'm actually enjoying the pace, despite having had some reservations of the series from the first couple of episodes, and I really enjoyed Saber vs Rider in episodes 11 and 12. Episode 12 brings the first case of Noble Phantasm vs Noble Phantasm. It was neat, and flashy with lots of lights. =)
One complaint: I really did not like the fact that the sfx for Rider's NP was a hawk/eagle/bird screech, as opposed to a horse whinny.
Quote from: "thepanda"I agree about the war. They really do need to play that up some more.
The next episode preview makes me hopeful that they've finally gotten out all of the exposition they needed to get out of the way. I cannot help but note that Type-Moon's previous series, Tsukihime, was said to suffer from just the opposite. The fans complained that too much was left out of the series. Now they have all the exposition and they complain about too much time being wasted explaining the set up.
Be careful what you wish for, indeed.
I don't have the same problem with the pacing that they do. Half and episode of exposition and half an episode of plot moving forward is perfectly fine for the early episodes in this kind of show. Now that the action has started and the explainations are (hopefully) out of the way I expect the series to pick up speed fairly rapidly.
I'm fine with the pacing, just not what's being set up.
I liked Tsukihime a good deal, with the 'good deal left out'. So *shrugs*
It was a tight enough story.
Dracos
I'm informed that the title for ep 14 or so is "Unlimited Bladeworks", so they might not stick to the 'Fate' scenario alone (... I hope. I really really hope. UBW Archer/Shirou interaction makes Shirou a much better character).
Quote from: "Sunhawk"
I'm informed that the title for ep 14 or so is "Unlimited Bladeworks", so they might not stick to the 'Fate' scenario alone (... I hope. I really really hope. UBW Archer/Shirou interaction makes Shirou a much better character).
Mwahahahahahaha! And your hopes are crushed and ground to dust!
^_^
Advantage, Liddo?
Dracos
The plushie is a little Japanese bastard who watches raws ^_^
You mean you don't, Kwoky?
Dracos
I don't speak Japanese ;_;
Damned be reality! =P
Dracos
Quote from: "Liddo-kun"Quote from: "Sunhawk"
I'm informed that the title for ep 14 or so is "Unlimited Bladeworks", so they might not stick to the 'Fate' scenario alone (... I hope. I really really hope. UBW Archer/Shirou interaction makes Shirou a much better character).
Mwahahahahahaha! And your hopes are crushed and ground to dust!
^_^
Actually according to spoilers I've seen elements of UBW might not be completely out of the running just yet. In fact it would appear that the series is heading towards an original ending using elements from all three story arcs.
With that in mind I DEMAND Shirou/Saber versus Gilgamesh & Rin versus Dark Sakura! @_@
Sincerely,
Shuten
But sakura is so nice!
Dracos
Quote from: "Dracos"But sakura is so nice!
Actually considering some of the stuff she goes thru in the game the fact that she's "nice" at all is truly a miracle. ^^;
Sincerely,
Shuten
Quote from: "Shuten"
Actually according to spoilers I've seen elements of UBW might not be completely out of the running just yet. In fact it would appear that the series is heading towards an original ending using elements from all three story arcs.
I know. I was thinking the exact same thing when I was watching the latest episode. It looks like they're trying to fudge in the UBW storyline -- foreshadowing in the new OP animation sequence?
I don't quite see where you're getting the hints of Heaven's Feel though.
Quote from: "Shuten"
With that in mind I DEMAND Shirou/Saber versus Gilgamesh & Rin versus Dark Sakura! @_@
For a quick sec there, I read that as Shiro and Saber take on Gilgamesh and Rin who are also fighting Dark Sakura.
Quote from: "Shuten"Actually according to spoilers I've seen elements of UBW might not be completely out of the running just yet. In fact it would appear that the series is heading towards an original ending using elements from all three story arcs.
Quote from: "Liddo-kun"I know. I was thinking the exact same thing when I was watching the latest episode. It looks like they're trying to fudge in the UBW storyline -- foreshadowing in the new OP animation sequence?
I don't quite see where you're getting the hints of Heaven's Feel though.
The hints are hard to spot but it has to do largely with the way Sakura and Rin interact with each other. F/SN is definitely one of those series where things happen for a reason. I refuse to believe that the awkward scenes between the two mean nothing.
That and Sakura's one of the main "heroines" anyway. Even if no element of "Heavens Feel" makes it in it would be stupid not to do anything with her character. In fact at the very least stuff will be happening with her. Deen has apparently made it quite clear they plan on giving Sakura more screentime.
I just hope that she doesn't end up as little more than the Classic Damsel in Distress type character. She deserves FAR better than that.
Unfortunately I'm starting to worry more and more that it might end up that way. >_<
Quote from: "Shuten"With that in mind I DEMAND Shirou/Saber versus Gilgamesh & Rin versus Dark Sakura! @_@
Quote from: "Liddo-kun"For a quick sec there, I read that as Shiro and Saber take on Gilgamesh and Rin who are also fighting Dark Sakura.
I see. o_O;
Sincerely,
Shuten
It's going to be odd if they bring her back in really after what feels like ten eps of absence. Especially with a fair deal of the holy war still 'out of view'.
So far, we're aware of two servant/masters out of the running as of ep 15. Giglamesh still hasn't shown up?
Anyhow, 15 was neater than I was expecting, though I hope they don't wipe out Rin. With one servant and rin and him, it's got a more balanced feel to it. Shirou is also starting to grow more to his own. The wishywashness of the past eps isn't being shown and he's holding pretty nicely to the resolutions we saw earlier now. I like that. It makes him a far more enjoyable main.
Dracos
Quote from: "Liddo-kun"Quote from: "Sunhawk"
I'm informed that the title for ep 14 or so is "Unlimited Bladeworks", so they might not stick to the 'Fate' scenario alone (... I hope. I really really hope. UBW Archer/Shirou interaction makes Shirou a much better character).
Mwahahahahahaha! And your hopes are crushed and ground to dust!
^_^
Eh, donno. I can't remember the episode number, but I remember SOMEONE saying there was an episode called that. I remain optimistic, my hopes uncrushed ^_^
Well, given they added him to the opener after his death sort of hints they're not done with him.
Dracos
For the record episode 14's title was "The Ideal Conclusion".
Episode titles. (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=5394&page=25)
Sincerely,
Shuten
So watched sixteen last night. Neat, but sort of anticlimatic way of ending that fight scene. They could, and should, have gone through with the dramatic battle using the sword rather than the single blow.
The end was meh. I suspect it's one of the other stories? We've still not seen gilgamesh.
We've got Lancer, Archer, Berserker, Assassin, Caster, Rider, Saber.
So that's seven, of which 3 (Rider, Berserk, Lancer) are dead. About right for halfway through the series, I suppose, and better than before, but at the same time...it's a little weak that we're seeing no conflict between the others and no 'deaths' happening on the other sets. Not even off camera references, given there were opening bits indicating the fighting had already started. They kind of needed some cast flex room for others to kill things so it's not all saber. It just doesn't really well...the aura of menace from the others is wussy given they've got zero kills under their belt and have basically been sitting low the entire time. It's particularly odd with assassin. They probably have a reason for it, but it leaves it feeling less like a war and more like 'everyone versus saber'.
And I don't know why they pulled Ilya over except to keep her on camera. The lack of background cast for her is starting to show as none of her minders are at all present.
Dracos
You made a typo. Lancer is alive, Archer's the one who's apparently bit it. Although as mentioned, the new OP does hint that they're not done with him. I actually do think he died, however when Shirou manages to unlock the UBW reality marble, he'll find himself fighting a guardian which will essentially be Archer. Something like that.
I'd like to note on your reference of off cast happenings, that you have to remember that if 3 are dead, there are only four left: Lancer, Saber, Caster, and Assassin. Saber we follow. Caster and Assassin are working together and they mention the fact that the only threats left are Saber and Lancer. They've been cautious and skulking about outside of the battlefield, or at least trying to. Lancer is also being cautious with his actions, though that's been referenced as more due to his master than his own choice, as seen when he fought Saber. He was willing to see things through, but his master wished for him to not drag things onward. So you've got three sides, of which two were essentially holding back and watching as things progressed with the development of Saber in the scene, and then Berserker, before they'd take action. Now that Berserker is gone and they've observed Saber, at least one side is willing to start putting into action their plans.
On Assassin's reasons for not moving, that's because his master asked him to stay and guard the gates to the temple I believe. That way the master will be protected, though Rider managed to penetrate it briefly while Assassin was occupied with Saber. It might also have to do with the energy concentration mentioned around the temple grounds. Considering who his master is, and that in ep 16 we learned Caster's own master isn't a magician, they're probably in a situation similar to Saber with Shirou, so they need to conserve their own energy.
On Ilya, yeah, it is a bit weak, and mostly just to appease fans, I suppose. Part of the reason though, is that there are masters/servants willing to go after masters without servants. Either to kill them, or in the case of servants, sometimes to bond with them. This way they can keep an eye on her, and Shirou being a dope, also does sort of like the girl, just thinks she hasn't been taught a whole lot of moral lessons, but thinks he's up for the job. But essentially, it's to keep her from getting into trouble.
Now why she doesn't just leave the country... well, who knows... ^_^
True, I did. Sorry, I typed that fast before heading off to chaos day.
Essentially, that's what I mean. As a war, it lacks mooks to be part of demonstrating the badassness. I dunno.. I recognize what they were doing, it just felt like it was too cut and dry how they did it in light of the fact that there was supposed to be both drainings and fights going on before it.
Additionally, it's getting odd with how many masters aren't 'really magicians', given what they've said of the war. It should be a very strong majority, yet outside of Shirou's 'i know nothing', we have shinji who barely has any (but at least is a magician in some sense), Ilya who isn't one yet has a super magic seal(?) and can hypnotize (odd given she's said she's not one), and now caster's? I dunno... I just think it's an odd decision that clashes a bit with the setting. Most of them should be magi as the whole summoning thing was originally placed as a great magical feat or whatnot. If Assassins master is not a real magician then we're looking at only Rin of the cast that can do any of the real magic that she indicates most magicians should be able to do. Yes, she's supposed to be really good at it, but it's just odd overall a bit. Not show breaking odd but... just sort of 'why are we seeing no magical side to this getting played?'
Ilya, my problem isn't so much with them watching over her, but that she established earlier that she has minders which look after her during her trip here. These people have not only never shown up but now been aggressively ignored. Shirou's a ctions seem reasonable enough. It's just for them it seems like they're slicing off her background to encourage 'haremville in shirou manor'.
Dracos
Technically speaking, Caster's master is the only master who's really not a magician period. He lacks magical ability in its entirety.
Shirou can cast reinforcement magic and his main problem is he was never really trained as a magician.
Ilya is definitely a magician, and one of high caliber. She just prefers to let Berserker do the maiming and powers her mana into him.
Shinji is from a family of magicians at least, so he had access to the rituals and some limited magic, as you said.
Assassin's and Lancer's masters we don't know the identity of (well, unless you know spoilers =p), but they really are magicians.
So essentially Caster's master is the only one who can't do magic or knows much about magic either. Then again, considering Caster is a magician servant, does he really need to? ^_^
I agree with your analysis of Ilya, but I recall her saying she wasn't a magician in it. I mean more, there's been a decisive lack of on screen magic-fu feeling from the masters. No sense of expertise at all from anyone but Rin.
Though yes, I expect Lancers to be so.
Dracos
Episode 17 is excellent. Now THAT is how you are supposed to pace an episode. I'm no longer sure which path they plan to take now, but I guess if a certain golden warrior shows up next episode...
Quote from: "thepanda"Episode 17 is excellent. Now THAT is how you are supposed to pace an episode. I'm no longer sure which path they plan to take now, but I guess if a certain golden warrior shows up next episode...
YES!!
And that's when Gilgamesh's contract is unexpectedly cancelled by Caster and re-forged with a shocked and an unwilling Shiro! Then in an oddly uncharacteristic move Gilgamesh's mana level dips to dangerous levels when he attempts to save his Master (but really he was saving Saber.) This act of self-sacrifice moves Shiro's heart and thus he performs the pelvic fusion dance to replenish Gilgamesh's reserves!
Now at full power (but unable to stop crying whenever he sees Saber) Gilgamesh, Saber, and Shrio take down evil and have their respective goals achieved! But the King of Kings has a long journey yet ahead as he travels back in time to correct an... incident in his past.
Or not.
>_>
<_<
Mmm, yeah, Ep 17 wasn't half bad. I dunno, the assassin fighter/master seemed a touch uber, but still within reason I suppose.
@_@
Dracos
Sleepy
Saw episode 18 raw and liked it for the most part.
Positives include Saber versus Assasin part 2, details about Rin and Sakura's connection, Chibi Sakura (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b174/epyonscythezero/Sakura/ChibiSakura01.jpg) is; yes that really is Sakura as a young child; just too cute, and Sakura in leather (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b174/epyonscythezero/Sakura/SakuraLeather01.jpg) = HOT! @_@
Negatives include Saber versus Assasin was too damned short, will more than likely be interrupted AGAIN, and unless things change soon my worry that Sakura might end up being little more than the stereotypical damsel in distress has only gotten worse with time.
Overall a decent episode but the big news for most everyone, excluding myself since I'm not a big fan of his at all but do not take that to mean that I hate him because I do not, is episode 19 should see the debut of a certain "Ougon no Ou" or for those who can't read japanese I'm pretty sure that translates to King of Gold which incidentally is also the name of episode 19.
I see character deaths coming... or maybe not. Only time will tell. ^^;
Sincerely,
Shuten
Quote from: "Shuten"I see character deaths coming... or maybe not. Only time will tell. ^^;
Wow... I actually got a prediction right. o_O;
Episode 19 brings in everyone's favorite Golden King voiced by Tomokazu Seki. (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=529) "Gate of Babylon" was definitely sweet to see and barring anything unforeseen the UBW/Heavens Feel fused arc has come to a close. I'm still kind of annoyed that my worst fears came true regarding Sakura. Of all the characters in the game and now the anime she's the most screwed over in my not so humble opinion.
Regardless at least they managed to fit in something from both. Beggars can't afford to be picky afterall and in the case of "Heavens Feel" we probably got the most we could get while still remaining within the restrictions of broadcast TV.
Onward to the modified "Fate" ending. Some will like it. Some will not. In my case I'm willing to tolerate it since they did manage to cram in some of the other two arcs.
Bleh! Enough of this... I'm just rambling now. >_<
Sincerely,
Shuten
Hmm, Saber's pretty devoted to being miserable.
Dracos
Well I saw the last episode raw and I only have three words to describe it.
"Tsukihime Ending Rehash"
Which is pretty much what was expected... such a damned disappointed. >_<
Sincerely,
Shuten
You know, you're right -- I hadn't thought to compare the two (just saw Tsukihime last weekend).
Ah, well. Gilgamesh's expression when he got smacked was golden. And there's always fanfics to fix things up ^_^
bah...that totally sucks. :\
Tsukihime's ending was a touch annoying as it was. Fate's being the same is just irritating, moreso as the side by side fighting was way more pronounced in Fate.
Dracos
It also doesn't help that they pretty much use Fate's ending. In my opinion it's the weakest of the three stories. Unlimited Blade Works and Heavens Feel are both so much better. I understand why they didn't go with a full Heavens Feel path but there's no excuse for not even considering a full UBW path.
I wonder if this means we've truly seen the beginning of...
Type Moon Anime Syndrome: Works by Type Moon that suffer from using the same basic ending every single time they are turned into anime productions.
I desperately hope not. Please let the manga NOT follow Fate's path. I'm not sure if I could stand seeing that ending a third damned time. >_<
Sincerely,
Shuten
Edit: To be fair the ending itself isn't bad and it does fit but I just can't help feeling like the series could have been so much more than what it ended up being. So much time squandered... -_-;
I've been playing the game and watching the anime in unison in the last few days and I demand to know who came up with the I AM THE BONE OF MY SWORD speech so that I can ask him or her:
a) Why did you start with a perfect suitable line like "I am the bone of my sword" and end with a perfectly suitable line like "So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works", and then fill in the middle with the most brokenly rhythmed English verses I've seen in recent (or as far as I can tell, long-term) memory? Especially that line that ends with the word "anything", which doesn't go with... anything.
b) Why both English versions of the speech have nigh-unto no connection with their Japanese meanings? How do you get "Steel is my body, and fire is my blood" from chishio wa tetsu de kokoro wa garasu (the blood is iron, and the heart is glass)?
I like the series and all, but this just makes me boggle. Especially since the Japanese versions seem to actually relate to Archer and Shirou's stories, and that's lost in the English versions.
Because localization is something that most people suck at. Especially musicians.
Dracos
Actually I suspect TypeMoon was going for the "This will sound "badass" in english if we have it said this way." factor more than anything else. I highly doubt they cared whether it was correct. It only mattered if it looked good. Of course whether they succeeded or not is something each person will have to decide for themselves.
In closing I'll pose a question, What is the complete literal translation for Shirou/Archer's individual UBW incantations anyway?
Sincerely,
Shuten
The verses I've generally seen are:
ARCHER'S UNLIMITED BLADE WORKS
I am the bone of my sword.
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood.
I have created over a thousand blades.
Unknown to death,
Nor known to life.
Have withstood pain to create many weapons.
Yet, those hands will never hold anything.
So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works.
SHIROU'S UNLIMITED BLADE WORKS
I am the bone of my sword.
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood.
I have created over a thousand blades.
Unaware of loss.
Nor aware of gain.
Withstood pain to create many weapons.
Waiting for one's arrival.
I have no regrets. This is the only path.
My whole life was "Unlimited Blade Works."
If incorrectness I be having, free feel to be correcting, yes? :-p
Here are the Japanese versions (might have to download a font if the characters don't show) plus my translations, keeping in mind that my translations might be more than a little off since three semesters of college Japanese don't make me an expert in poetic syntax. I just translated the words and fit them together with hints from their particles in the way that most matches the speaker's story.
ARCHER'S UNLIMITED BLADE WORKS
体は 剣で 出来ている
血潮は鉄で 心は硝子
幾たびの戦場を越えて不敗
ただの一度も敗走はなく
ただの一度も理解されない
彼の者は常に独り
剣の丘で勝利に酔う
故に、生涯に意味はなく
その体は きっと剣で出来ていた
karada wa tsurugi de dekite iru
The body is created by the sword
chishio wa tetsu de kokoro wa garasu
The blood is iron, the heart is glass
ikutabi no senjou o koete fuhai
How many battlefields have been crossed over, invincible?
tada no ichido mo haisou wa naku
Never once was there a single retreat
tada no ichido mo rikai sarenai
Nor once was there ever being understood
kare no mono wa tsune ni hitori
His self was constantly, always alone
tsurugi no oka de shouri ni you
At the hill of swords, he drank to victory
yue ni shougai ni imi wa naku
Thus there was no meaning to his entire life
sono karada wa kitto tsurugi de dekite ita
That body was surely created by the sword
SHIROU'S UNLIMITED BLADE WORKS
体は 剣で 出来ている
血潮は鉄で 心は硝子
幾たびの戦場を越えて不敗
ただ一度の敗走はなく
ただ一度の勝利もなし
担い手はここに孤り。
剣の丘で鉄を鍛つ
ならば 我が生涯に意味は不要ず
この体は無限の剣で出来ていた
karada wa tsurugi de dekiteiru
The body is created by the sword
chishio wa tetsu de kokoro wa garase
The blood is iron, the heart is glass
ikutabi no senjou o koete fuhai
How many battlefields have been crossed over, invincible?
tada ichido no haisou wa naku
Never once was there a single retreat
tada ichido no ryouri mo nashi
Nor once was there ever a victory
ninai te wa koko ni minashigori
Here is a bearer, an orphan
tsurugi no oka de tetsu o kitaetsu
At the hill of swords, iron is forged
naraba wa ga shougai ni imi wa fuyousu
Thus my entire life has no need of meaning
kono karada wa mugen no tsurugi de dekite ita
This body was created by infinite swords
Sunhawk, that wasn't what I was refering to. I know both of those but thanks for the consideration. By the way that is TypeMoon's "translation" and not the literal one I was interested in.
KLSymph, that's exactly what I wanted to know... Thanks. ^^
Sincerely,
Shuten
Don't suppose anyone wants to take a crack at translating these (http://dies.archer.nu/goods.php)? The Comic Battle collections are in Chinese though (or the first one is, didn't look at the second one).
Finally ended up watching the ending. Shuten's right, it's kind of lame how they ended like Tsukihime. Slightly better, in a way, but also left me going "And what's next?" I dunno. You've got practically the start of a sentai team sitting at the end. A set of mages and wild energetic people.
Dracos
Having just seen the ending myself, I'll just say in conclusion that, story and ending aside, this anime suffers greatly from "attack names five notches more awesome than attack animations" syndrome.
Most plainly demonstrated by Gilgamesh. Enûma Elish is supposed to be a rank EX anti-world attack, but apparently all an EX/anti-world attack amounts to in the end is a lot of red swiggles and a trench (and frankly I've seen more impressive drainage ditches in China).
Hard to forgive when the only thing I was looking forward to in an anime of the game was better animation (and voice work, which was okay).
The whole anti-personnel, anti-weapon, anti-army, anti-world shit?
Total crap.
Dracos
Quote from: "Dracos"The whole anti-personnel, anti-weapon, anti-army, anti-world shit?
Total crap.
I agree. The problem is it's hard to discount it without breaking suspension of disbelief over the entire metaphysics of the story. I demand consistency like everyone else after all, so if you say that a certain group of people are legendary heroic spirits, and Gilgamesh is really the mythical demi-god Gilgamesh, fine. If you say that his sword is named after the Babylonian deity of creation and magic, and that sword's ability is named after the Babylonian creation epic, fine though pretty pompous. If you make up some sort of classification/rating system, and tell me that the ability is really powerful and has a extremely specific, descriptive blurb like "The Star of Creation that Splits Heaven and Earth", I am going to expect that the actual thing is not very far from its name on the awesomeness scale, especially since the user has the qualifications to have a weapon like that.
This sort of discrepancy sort of ruins the entire concept, and I'm a big proponent of setting up correctly and delivering for maximum effect. I have to decide between not accepting the final product or not accepting the setup. Bah. Makes me wish for the overkill of Dragon Ball Z.
Quote from: "Dracos"Finally ended up watching the ending. Shuten's right, it's kind of lame how they ended like Tsukihime. Slightly better, in a way, but also left me going "And what's next?" I dunno. You've got practically the start of a sentai team sitting at the end. A set of mages and wild energetic people.
Dracos
What's next? Why, Ilya confesses that she's been cheating on Shirou with Rin, Saber re-appears at Shirou's door pregnant with Kotomine's child, Sakura runs off with Taiga Fujimura, and Shirou sighs and stares longingly at a painting of Gilgamesh...
It's "Fate/Stay Night: The Soap Opera Continues"!
Quote from: "KLSymph"Quote from: "Dracos"The whole anti-personnel, anti-weapon, anti-army, anti-world shit?
Total crap.
I agree. The problem is it's hard to discount it without breaking suspension of disbelief over the entire metaphysics of the story. I demand consistency like everyone else after all, so if you say that a certain group of people are legendary heroic spirits, and Gilgamesh is really the mythical demi-god Gilgamesh, fine. If you say that his sword is named after the Babylonian deity of creation and magic, and that sword's ability is named after the Babylonian creation epic, fine though pretty pompous. If you make up some sort of classification/rating system, and tell me that the ability is really powerful and has a extremely specific, descriptive blurb like "The Star of Creation that Splits Heaven and Earth", I am going to expect that the actual thing is not very far from its name on the awesomeness scale, especially since the user has the qualifications to have a weapon like that.
This sort of discrepancy sort of ruins the entire concept, and I'm a big proponent of setting up correctly and delivering for maximum effect. I have to decide between not accepting the final product or not accepting the setup. Bah. Makes me wish for the overkill of Dragon Ball Z.
Absolutely. What I mean more is it never should've been added. If they hadn't gone and inserted the largely extraneous 'anti-x' thing into the anime, it never would've come up. I wonder how extraneous it is in the original game as well.
Quote from: "Dracos"I wonder how extraneous it is in the original game as well.
Actually, it's mostly because the classification was presented pretty nicely in the game that made me look forward to it in the anime. In the game, there was a section in the "extras" menu (along with the gallery, sound test, etc.) called "status", which listed all the Servants, gave their ratings, and listed their attacks. And the section was well laid out too, menus and pictures and spiffy font, so you know somebody took the time to write up all of this info and make it presentable. Since it
was "extras", you can say it was pretty extraneous, and I don't remember it really being an issue in the game itself.
The thing about the classifications in the game, though, was that if you looked at the gallery art for the attacks, there wasn't anything about the depictions that contradicted the classifications. Enuma Elish in the game art (which was Gilgamesh with the Ea, charging up the attack) was detailed and colorful (lot more than the anime made it look) and it
looked powerful, proportionally more powerful than the pictures for attacks that were reportedly not as good. Which makes sense.
So I don't really blame the presence of the whole anti-whatever classification for being too exaggerated. It seems to fit the concept and it's not hard to say to myself "maybe Gilgamesh toned it down because he didn't want to do that much damage". It's just that I don't see why they couldn't at least make the attack animation as good as the game art hinted.
Vacationing in China has left me much of the time sitting on trains going through the countryside. Since my laptop has only a two-hour battery, and these rides are 12 to 24-hour ones, I've spent my idle time doing essentially meaningless things. Just to demonstrate that I can do more than criticize the I am the bone speech, I've thought up my own version by mixing and matching lines from the originals.
Anyway, the skill of making quotable quotes is very useful for writing fanfics that aren't forgotten after one reading, and I'm always on the lookout for chances to practice.
Best viewed side by side, I think, and it loses something without a scene to provide context. Unfortunately I don't have the time to try to table the post, much less type out two full scenes.
===
ARCHER
I am the bone of my sword--
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood.
I have created
Over a thousand blades.
How many fields
Of battle have I crossed,
Unknown to Death, nor known to Life?
Though I have suffered, and endured,
To create many weapons,
Nothing will be, by these hands,
Ever held--
So as I pray,
Unlimited Blade Works.
===
SHIROU
I am the bone of my sword--
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood.
I have created
Over a thousand blades.
How many fields
Of battle have I passed,
Neither knowing loss, nor knowing gain?
I suffer and endure,
To create many weapons,
Forever as I wait for one--
I have no regrets.
This is the only path.
My whole life was Unlimited Blade Works--
My body was born from infinite swords.
===
Since I have maybe three minutes left of webcafe time, I'll leave the explanation for the changes (and there's a paragraph or two for each change and wording; I had a whole lot of time) for when I get back.