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[Haruhi][Rewrite] Later

Started by Brian, September 24, 2011, 02:40:34 PM

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Brian

...yet again, I am taking a crack at this. >_>;

Special thanks to Hal for his help with the first few chapters.  This is a rewrite trying to fix various issues, most of them having to do with tenses and formatting.  Er, and the entire ending.  Pick hollywood or indie (but probably not both; I prefer hollywood myself).

Yeah, that needs some work.

Prologue through chapter three are attached to this post.

Original (extra bummer) Chapter 7+Epilogue.

Yay!  Increased attachment limits!
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

sarsaparilla

#1
I missed the previous version, so I'm approaching this with a blank slate.

The only part where I have a minor problem is that Haruhi's swearing strikes me as jarring and crude. It doesn't exactly sound like her, but even more importantly it is in a stark contrast with the general atmosphere of the story.

That said, at this point I can only offer praise for a work that is exceedingly well researched, refined, contemplative, and immensely melancholic (although it depressed me the last point is meant as a compliment, too).

I can't even begin to guess where this story is heading.

Brian

Hmm, I wanted Haruhi's rough language to be a bit jarring; Kyon's become very set in his ways and she represents a major disruption to that.  On the other hand, I don't want to present Haruhi as being too harsh, either.

If it's too jarring then I can tone it down.

Actually, in retrospect, some of that might be a bit too crude for her ... well.  A thirty year old her, anyway.  I think I see where I went wrong there.

Alright, ideal; thanks for the feedback, and I hope that the ultimate conclusion is at least a bit uplifting, though the story in general will have it's ups and downs.
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

Halbarad

#3
I will avoid spoilers since you didn't read the original posting, although I may hint at some later plot elements for C&C purposes. Fair warning!

Chapter the zeroth.

QuoteNear the driveway is a lawn -- which is not really a garden.

Should be a comma here.

Quotewell trained hedges

--> well-trained

Quoteand walk beneath the tori that defines the entrance

There's a giant argument lurking around here about romanization styles (Hepburn vs. Kunrei-shiki). I'm personally a fan of Hepburn as Kunrei-shiki tends to look terse IMO, but either way, I'd recommend 'torii' here. May want to italicize it as a loanword or may not.

QuoteI catch two familiar voices -- Tsuruya, and her son, Kintaro.

Could stand to lose the comma after Tsuruya.

QuoteHis hair is like his mother's, but more subdued in tone, more of a duller gray than her own vibrant green, but he has inherited her grin.

Bit of a run-on here, you have two conjunction splices. Multiple ways to rework; I'd personally suggest:

His hair is more subdued in tone than his mother's, more of a dull gray to her own vibrant green, but he's inherited her grin completely.

Quotebut still set them within the confines of the garden.

'them' is not needed here.

Quotethough, the very outermost ring swirls around the bonsai in a complex braided spiral, weaving the five of them together with whorls that make them look connected, almost a single object, despite the significant area they cover.

Comma overload! Kill the one after 'though', and I'd change the one after 'connected' to an em-dash and lose the one after 'object'.

QuoteThe other two stones I decided to treat differently, combing lines to connect them, and then giving those lines (and the stones at their endpoints, naturally), another, intentionally irregular form.

And more! Can lose the ones after 'them' and 'another'.

QuoteHe's got better things to do than fill his head with all of the poetry he can memorize. Even if that does seem to be his goal, most days.

I'd splice these two sentences together with an em-dash, the second one is a fragment.

QuoteShe paises briefly, then.

paises -> pauses. I'd change 'then' to something else as well - either 'at that' or 'after that'.

QuoteHer eyes aren't looking at me, yet

Comma is unneeded here.


I'll post commentary on chapter 1 a bit later.
I am a terrible person.
Excellent Youkai.

sarsaparilla

After reflecting on it I felt compelled to add one more thought. The reason for why this story touched me so deeply is because it perfectly embodies the aesthetics of wabi-sabi, and that makes even the melancholy a taste to relish.

Brian

Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PMI will avoid spoilers since you didn't read the original posting, although I may hint at some later plot elements for C&C purposes. Fair warning!
Always the option of spoiler tags, too. ;)
Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PM
QuoteNear the driveway is a lawn -- which is not really a garden.

Should be a comma here.
Okay, unless I comment otherwise, I will be using all of your grammar suggestions.  Especially ~*sniff*~ with regards to my beloved commas. ;.;
Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PM
Quoteand walk beneath the tori that defines the entrance
There's a giant argument lurking around here about romanization styles (Hepburn vs. Kunrei-shiki). I'm personally a fan of Hepburn as Kunrei-shiki tends to look terse IMO, but either way, I'd recommend 'torii' here. May want to italicize it as a loanword or may not.
Argument averted: It's a typo.  I'd intended to use 'torii' anyway. ._.

I'm also really bad about even realizing I'm using loanwords.  The last time I thought, 'wait, this might be a bit much,' was when I was writing Chronoguchi's speech in Shuffle -- then I justified it to myself by saying, 'these are tropes, though.'  Heh.  I ... really need to be better about that.
Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PM
QuoteHis hair is like his mother's, but more subdued in tone, more of a duller gray than her own vibrant green, but he has inherited her grin.
Bit of a run-on here, you have two conjunction splices. Multiple ways to rework; I'd personally suggest:

His hair is more subdued in tone than his mother's, more of a dull gray to her own vibrant green, but he's inherited her grin completely.
I'll go with that.
Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PMpaises -> pauses. I'd change 'then' to something else as well - either 'at that' or 'after that'.
Ugh, a spelling error this late in the game. :p

How about:
QuoteShe pauses for a moment, reflecting on the line.
I dropped the ', now' from the next line, too. >_>
Quote from: Halbarad on September 24, 2011, 06:36:14 PMI'll post commentary on chapter 1 a bit later.
I see what you did there.

Okay, thank you very much as always, Hal. :D

I'm afraid I haven't actually changed much of the content in the early chapters; I'm mostly trying to fix the (pretty awful) tense issues I blundered into. :X
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

Brian

#6
Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 25, 2011, 06:34:03 AMAfter reflecting on it I felt compelled to add one more thought. The reason for why this story touched me so deeply is because it perfectly embodies the aesthetics of wabi-sabi, and that makes even the melancholy a taste to relish.
That is ... pretty much exactly what I was aiming for there.  On your advice, I toned down Haruhi's roughness a bit in chapter one.  Tenses in this chapter shift a bit more, so apologies for that.

Also, I realized I should be italicizing titles instead of putting them in quotes.  >.>;

Here's chapter two; I should have three done in a day or so. :)

I have also updated the prologue and first chapter with the suggestions I've received so far.

Edit: Updated chapter two ... in the first post. >.>;;
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

Muphrid

Eheh, timing.  I'm late to the party.

QuoteDue to the relatively private nature of the Tsuruya family, they instead employ a single gardener, who works year round.

Perhaps "year-round"?

QuoteThen again, very little of what you know in childhood tends to follow you until adulthood. In my experience, a very small handful of the friends you make in school will be true enough to still be at your side when you are older. It's not that things come up, and friends stop being friends ... but distance develops ... grows between people.

Incredibly minor nitpick. "Until" might suggest that, even if that knowledge did follow you, it would stop at adulthood anyway.  Maybe "through" instead?

QuoteA once-dear friend is seen again, and then there's the dull realization that after all that time, they really, aren't friends ... not like they used to be. Acquaintances, but the spark of friendship doesn't quite rekindle; common interests just don't connect.

I think the comma after "really" could be removed.

QuoteThe sand garden is a relatively private area, really, like much of the estate. Acoustically, it doesn't let a lot of sound out, but there are still points where one, a gardener, perhaps, can listen discreetly. I do, and I catch two familiar voices -- Tsuruya, and her son, Kintaro.

Since there are already several commas in the sentence already, I do wonder if there's a better way to set off "a gardener".  You already use a dash later in the paragraph, though, which would've been the most obvious choice.  Hence, I don't have any specific suggestion.

QuoteAt this time of day, he's just arrived home from school, and is eagerly telling his mother, "...and tomorrow, we're going to start reading up on Basho!"

The comma after "school" probably indicates a pause, but when I read it, I don't really want a pause to be there.

QuoteI nod in answer. "Um ... you're staying here, then?"

"For a few days," she agrees. "Tsuruya-san...." She looks uncomfortable and places one hand on her side, sliding across her stomach as though brushing off some dust before resting it above her hip, looking away at the cloudy sky. "Well, for a few days." Her mouth quirks into a smile as her hand drops to her side, and she teases, "Inviting me to stay with you, then?"

Is "agrees" the right word here?  Right now, she's confirming Kyon's guess, although I don't know if I'd use "confirm" in a dialogue tag unless I felt I really had no other choice--you know me, I hate to be redundant with that, but maybe that could work for you.

QuoteShe shakes her head quickly. "Just.... Oh, well ... I thought she liked you, you know?" she asks, though it's not really a question. "Um ... so, you know, Mikuru-chan walks off one day. A few years later, even though I tried, you ran away.... And when I told Nagato, she vanished, too!" She stills herself, forcing that smile that I'm starting to realize is a mask ... more natural than Koizumi's, but still a mask. "Ah ... but ... that was so long ago.... Lunch tomorrow, huh?"

I don't remember if we discussed this before, but even with the passage of time, it seems unnatural for Haruhi to refer to Nagato as...well, "Nagato," at least to me.

Quote"Ah...." I check my mental calendar. Tomorrow night was originally planned to be a 'family' dinner night -- Tsuruya, Kintaro, and 'Auntie' (my sister) over to join Nagato and I. Tsuruya liked the idea of a weekly tradition for Kintaro, and honestly, I didn't much mind. "Nagato, as always," I agree, mustering a smile. Judging by Haruhi's expression, she's keen on finding out the identity of my sister, but I'll ignore that for now; a harmless mystery she can unravel with Tsuruya's assistance while I try and clear my head.

I realize I don't quite know what this refers to:  "identity of my sister"?

Quote"Did she say what brought her by, by any chance?" I ask. It's not exactly something we speak of ... but I had been under the impression that Haruhi was upset with Tsuruya. They'd been friends in high school, but Asahina-san's disappearance changed that. Haruhi believed that Tsuruya had to know where Asahina-san went, and just wouldn't tell her--

I'm not sure about this comma after "went".

Quote"Do you think ... she found Mikuru-chan?" she asks very softly.

"Mikuru-chan" instead of "Mikuru"--this is probably fine, again given the passage of time.

QuoteI spend a few minutes trying to catch my breath -- sort this all out in my head. Probably I look like I'm obsessed with finding the world's most perfect daikon radish before I give up on the shopping excuse. I find a bench outside and sit down, just trying to clear my head of thoughts and breathe.

A question, since I'm not really sure--is it redundant to say "daikon radish"?  I know saying "daikon" alone may not even get the meaning across, so I guess the natural thing to do is what's written, but I did want to ask.

QuoteI felt sick and miserable, though when she glanced at me, she took it for pre-test jitters. Why was it that Haruhi was so set on the SOS Brigade banding together? Well, trying to hold together.... How could she not recognize that, at the end of the day ... I just didn't have what it took to keep up? There she was, offering to help me out by taking care of my cat when I got into Toudai. Reading between the lines, she probably already paid the pet deposit on her apartment. Just so she could keep me close?

I'd had the expectation for a long while that I wouldn't be able to keep up with Haruhi. I mean, she was super-gifted at everything she does. She has no real comprehension -- even though she herself was my primary tutor -- how much easier it was for her over me. In absolutely everything. There was no field she didn't excel at, above and beyond my ability, if she set herself on doing it. So, what hope did a mere mortal have of really impressing her? Add in the fact that the one area I knew things she didn't ... I could never tell her about. Let's face it, anyone would feel inadequate in my place, given enough time.

Even so, it was the manner of my inadequacy that managed to stagger me.

I'll confess, the signs were there, but I didn't see it coming. Obviously, for it to be bothering her as much as it had ... she didn't either. So, at the end of the day, I just couldn't make the cut. I thought it would be some realization of her power that would be the thing that separated us ... not me running away from the fact that I just wasn't good enough.

And then, no matter how you look at it, even if she tried her hardest.... I'd become a charity case. In the best case scenario, I'd be an endearing loser -- not genuinely able to participate on the level. Letting that sensation fester for a few years....

Don't get the wrong idea. I didn't have anything against Haruhi. At that point, as long as we'd known each other, she really was trying to be a friend to me. We can thank Asahina-san for that, I suppose. It was just that ... I was tired. I couldn't deal with it anymore.

So ... when the train was boarding, I waited until the last moment and slipped back off the car while Haruhi was looking for seats. For a moment, when the doors shut, before it lurched into motion, I was afraid that being herself, she would pull the emergency brake.

But then, you've just listened to me complain about how sorry I was feeling for myself because she's much smarter than I will ever be. She understood well enough. She knew I wasn't lost. She made it to a window, so I saw her for one last moment before the train sped away.

She looked bewildered, angry.... Beneath that, she looked determined.

And so ... I ran.

A hard life lesson: We don't always get what we want.

I couldn't think of any other way to get the point across.

Really ... for myself, as much as her.

I wanted to quote this whole passage because it really drives the story.  After two years of trying to get into Tokyo University for no other reason than Haruhi demanded it of him, Kyon's feelings of inadequacy seem entirely justified.  There's even a hint of jealousy that Haruhi can get in and succeed so effortlessly, resentment that she has apparent power over him in expecting his admission and driving him to go for it even when he otherwise wouldn't want to. 

But there's one key line:
QuoteSo, what hope did a mere mortal have of really impressing her?

This is the tacit admission of what Kyon feels for her, too, isn't it?  That he wants to live up to her standard and feels that, inevitably, he can't.  Haruhi has an unrealistic expectation of him, and that would extend beyond just him getting into university, wouldn't it?  It already extends deep into their relationship.


Overall, reading this now for the second time, I'd forgotten that the nature of Kyon and Haruhi's separation was revealed so early, but it's helped me in terms of looking back at the big picture instead of being mired in the small--already knowing more or less what was to come, I could focus on how all the elements fit together.  I think I felt before the first parts of this story were very strong, that the future of Kyon, Nagato, and Tsuruya was detailed and felt real.  So far, that hasn't changed.

sarsaparilla

In reply to chapter 2:

Somehow, while this chapter was still melancholic in its contemplation of what could have been but never was, there were also glimpses of optimism in the honesty with which the characters treated even painful things, suggesting that some degree of healing is possible.

If I wanted to pick one issue here it would have to be the way Koizumi is portrayed. While another extremely dark interpretation of his personality and motives is certainly your prerogative, I believe that Downfall already took that concept to its logical conclusion, and using the same basic premise here detracts from the whole by giving him more focus than is needed for the purpose of this story (or what I imagine it to be as I don't know yet where things are going).

I guess that what I want to say is that I believe that Koizumi would be completely capable of running his relationship with Haruhi into ground just by being himself as described in the books; there isn't any need for invoking megalomaniac plans for world domination to make it happen.

Also, Koizumi's ultimate fate as described here casts a shadow of doubt on Haruhi. In canon Kyon believes that Haruhi would never really wish anybody dead, but after this chapter it is almost impossible to prove that Haruhi didn't have anything to do with it. In this case I would very much like to agree with Kyon (though Downfall certainly grated much more in this respect when Haruhi didn't reverse Koizumi's worse-than-death punishment after she found out that Kyon was in a much better shape than she had thought).

Brian

#9
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMEheh, timing.  I'm late to the party.
Fashionably so!
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
QuoteDue to the relatively private nature of the Tsuruya family, they instead employ a single gardener, who works year round.
Perhaps "year-round"?
Okay, unless remarked otherwise, I'll use your grammar suggestions.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
QuoteThen again, very little of what you know in childhood tends to follow you until adulthood. In my experience, a very small handful of the friends you make in school will be true enough to still be at your side when you are older. It's not that things come up, and friends stop being friends ... but distance develops ... grows between people.
Incredibly minor nitpick. "Until" might suggest that, even if that knowledge did follow you, it would stop at adulthood anyway.  Maybe "through" instead?
What about ... 'into'?
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
QuoteThe sand garden is a relatively private area, really, like much of the estate. Acoustically, it doesn't let a lot of sound out, but there are still points where one, a gardener, perhaps, can listen discreetly. I do, and I catch two familiar voices -- Tsuruya, and her son, Kintaro.
Since there are already several commas in the sentence already, I do wonder if there's a better way to set off "a gardener".  You already use a dash later in the paragraph, though, which would've been the most obvious choice.  Hence, I don't have any specific suggestion.
Reorder?  'perhaps a gardener' let me omit a comma.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMIs "agrees" the right word here?  Right now, she's confirming Kyon's guess, although I don't know if I'd use "confirm" in a dialogue tag unless I felt I really had no other choice--you know me, I hate to be redundant with that, but maybe that could work for you.
I tend to abuse it; 'allows'?

Otherwise I can probably just go with 'says'.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMI don't remember if we discussed this before, but even with the passage of time, it seems unnatural for Haruhi to refer to Nagato as...well, "Nagato," at least to me.
Hmm, no, that's a slip on my part; she should still be 'Yuki', and I think it in later conversation.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
Quote"Ah...." I check my mental calendar. Tomorrow night was originally planned to be a 'family' dinner night -- Tsuruya, Kintaro, and 'Auntie' (my sister) over to join Nagato and I. Tsuruya liked the idea of a weekly tradition for Kintaro, and honestly, I didn't much mind. "Nagato, as always," I agree, mustering a smile. Judging by Haruhi's expression, she's keen on finding out the identity of my sister, but I'll ignore that for now; a harmless mystery she can unravel with Tsuruya's assistance while I try and clear my head.
I realize I don't quite know what this refers to:  "identity of my sister"?
Ah, this is the fact that Kyon's sister is the one that Kintaro calls 'Auntie'.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMI'm not sure about this comma after "went".
I think it can be dropped.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM"Mikuru-chan" instead of "Mikuru"--this is probably fine, again given the passage of time.
Hmm.  I ... didn't realize that was off.  Looking back, you're right, but I think I'll leave it as is, yeah.  An acceptible slip, it seems. :p
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMA question, since I'm not really sure--is it redundant to say "daikon radish"?  I know saying "daikon" alone may not even get the meaning across, so I guess the natural thing to do is what's written, but I did want to ask.
I think I can be a bit more general here; I'm probably overdoing it a bit.  It appears that just 'diakon' should be fine, but since I tend to overdo the loanwords etc., I'll let this one go.

"Probably I look like I'm obsessed with finding the world's most perfect vegetables before I give up on the shopping excuse." should do just as well.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMThis is the tacit admission of what Kyon feels for her, too, isn't it?  That he wants to live up to her standard and feels that, inevitably, he can't.  Haruhi has an unrealistic expectation of him, and that would extend beyond just him getting into university, wouldn't it?  It already extends deep into their relationship.
There is also the final line of the chapter, which (I thought) was a bit less subtle, but yes, that's generally how Kyon felt to motivate that course of action....
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMOverall, reading this now for the second time, I'd forgotten that the nature of Kyon and Haruhi's separation was revealed so early, but it's helped me in terms of looking back at the big picture instead of being mired in the small--already knowing more or less what was to come, I could focus on how all the elements fit together.  I think I felt before the first parts of this story were very strong, that the future of Kyon, Nagato, and Tsuruya was detailed and felt real.  So far, that hasn't changed.
Great; excellent.  Hopefully I can deliver a better ending this time around. :D

Agh, forgot to mention thank you very much for the commentary; that was quite helpful.
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

Brian

Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 25, 2011, 04:29:00 PMSomehow, while this chapter was still melancholic in its contemplation of what could have been but never was, there were also glimpses of optimism in the honesty with which the characters treated even painful things, suggesting that some degree of healing is possible.
Okay, good, that was largely what I was aiming for.
Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 25, 2011, 04:29:00 PMIf I wanted to pick one issue here it would have to be the way Koizumi is portrayed. While another extremely dark interpretation of his personality and motives is certainly your prerogative, I believe that Downfall already took that concept to its logical conclusion, and using the same basic premise here detracts from the whole by giving him more focus than is needed for the purpose of this story (or what I imagine it to be as I don't know yet where things are going).

I guess that what I want to say is that I believe that Koizumi would be completely capable of running his relationship with Haruhi into ground just by being himself as described in the books; there isn't any need for invoking megalomaniac plans for world domination to make it happen.

Also, Koizumi's ultimate fate as described here casts a shadow of doubt on Haruhi. In canon Kyon believes that Haruhi would never really wish anybody dead, but after this chapter it is almost impossible to prove that Haruhi didn't have anything to do with it. In this case I would very much like to agree with Kyon (though Downfall certainly grated much more in this respect when Haruhi didn't reverse Koizumi's worse-than-death punishment after she found out that Kyon was in a much better shape than she had thought).
Well, the Downfall thing is a separate issue.  I didn't have a good way to bring it into the narrative, but Koizumi's burning wouldn't have been eternal; if Haruhi doesn't do it herself, Kuyou would have fixed it.  I'm kind of stumped on handling that to fix it ... I had a few ideas, but I've decided to table them and focus on one re-write at a time.

So, I had a whole list of counter-arguments and justifications for using this characterization of Koizumi -- until I looked at it and realized that's what they were.

Okay.  You're right; there's no reason to villify Koizumi here, and it doesn't end up adding much to the story.  I didn't phrase the 'world domination' thing well at all; that's actually meant to be 'standard corporate buzzword' not 'cryptic message of doom' (and it doesn't help that Kyon, here doesn't follow corporate buzzwords).  Easily changed to 'rule the financial world.'  This is meant to be Koizumi trying to project interest in something Haruhi finds dull onto her (and leads to what you were suggesting), not more sinister conspiracies.

Secondly, it's a complete failure on my part to disregard the fact that, you're right; Haruhi wouldn't wish death upon someone like that.  And Kyon wouldn't have just accepted it like that as she presented it anyway.  I'm honestly rather amazed I don't recall this being pointed out to me before.  Maybe I just filtered it out until I managed to work it out in Downfall.  >_<

Anyway.  For the plot of the story, Koizumi does, unfortunately, need to die there.

But he can be a sympathetic character, and Haruhi doesn't need to be responsible.  In fact, that leads into later developments much better than the original story strucuture allowed!  Excellent; this represents a good deal of work, but I believe you've identified one of the factors that was working against this story instead of for it, and allows me to much better foreshadow some critical aspects of the ending....

I'm afraid the next chapter will be delayed, because now I know how to fix this one!  (And ... subsequent chapters, too.)

Thank you very much for your feedback!
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

Muphrid

Sympathetic Koizumi--hmm, mayhap what can be done (if you haven't already settled on a specific angle, that is) is to consider the stress Koizumi must've been under.  With Kyon having bowed out, the onus falls almost entirely on him to direct Haruhi's energies into what he considers safe and neutral.  Trying to keep up with Haruhi is no easy task.  I can see something where Koizumi simply stressed himself out to the point of his body breaking down under that weight.

But feel free to disregard that; I'm sure there are several ways to put a tragic spin on him here.

Quote from: Brian on September 26, 2011, 02:59:54 AM
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
QuoteThen again, very little of what you know in childhood tends to follow you until adulthood. In my experience, a very small handful of the friends you make in school will be true enough to still be at your side when you are older. It's not that things come up, and friends stop being friends ... but distance develops ... grows between people.
Incredibly minor nitpick. "Until" might suggest that, even if that knowledge did follow you, it would stop at adulthood anyway.  Maybe "through" instead?
What about ... 'into'?

Sounds reasonable.


Quote from: Brian on September 26, 2011, 03:01:16 AM
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
QuoteThe sand garden is a relatively private area, really, like much of the estate. Acoustically, it doesn't let a lot of sound out, but there are still points where one, a gardener, perhaps, can listen discreetly. I do, and I catch two familiar voices -- Tsuruya, and her son, Kintaro.
Since there are already several commas in the sentence already, I do wonder if there's a better way to set off "a gardener".  You already use a dash later in the paragraph, though, which would've been the most obvious choice.  Hence, I don't have any specific suggestion.
Reorder?  'perhaps a gardener' let me omit a comma.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMIs "agrees" the right word here?  Right now, she's confirming Kyon's guess, although I don't know if I'd use "confirm" in a dialogue tag unless I felt I really had no other choice--you know me, I hate to be redundant with that, but maybe that could work for you.
I tend to abuse it; 'allows'?

Otherwise I can probably just go with 'says'.

Either would seem workable.


Quote from: Brian on September 26, 2011, 03:01:16 AM
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PM
Quote"Ah...." I check my mental calendar. Tomorrow night was originally planned to be a 'family' dinner night -- Tsuruya, Kintaro, and 'Auntie' (my sister) over to join Nagato and I. Tsuruya liked the idea of a weekly tradition for Kintaro, and honestly, I didn't much mind. "Nagato, as always," I agree, mustering a smile. Judging by Haruhi's expression, she's keen on finding out the identity of my sister, but I'll ignore that for now; a harmless mystery she can unravel with Tsuruya's assistance while I try and clear my head.
I realize I don't quite know what this refers to:  "identity of my sister"?
Ah, this is the fact that Kyon's sister is the one that Kintaro calls 'Auntie'.

Oh, okay, Haruhi thinks 'Auntie' refers to Kyon's wife.


Quote from: Brian on September 26, 2011, 03:01:16 AM
Quote from: Muphrid on September 25, 2011, 01:55:50 PMA question, since I'm not really sure--is it redundant to say "daikon radish"?  I know saying "daikon" alone may not even get the meaning across, so I guess the natural thing to do is what's written, but I did want to ask.
I think I can be a bit more general here; I'm probably overdoing it a bit.  It appears that just 'diakon' should be fine, but since I tend to overdo the loanwords etc., I'll let this one go.

"Probably I look like I'm obsessed with finding the world's most perfect vegetables before I give up on the shopping excuse." should do just as well.

Eh, I do like the specificity of it.  Up to you.


Glad to be of assistance.

Brian

Quote from: Muphrid on September 26, 2011, 03:38:44 AM
Sympathetic Koizumi--hmm, mayhap what can be done (if you haven't already settled on a specific angle, that is) is to consider the stress Koizumi must've been under.  With Kyon having bowed out, the onus falls almost entirely on him to direct Haruhi's energies into what he considers safe and neutral.  Trying to keep up with Haruhi is no easy task.  I can see something where Koizumi simply stressed himself out to the point of his body breaking down under that weight.

But feel free to disregard that; I'm sure there are several ways to put a tragic spin on him here.
That's about exactly what I'm aiming for, I just want to avoid implications of suicide or anything like that.  This even lets me have Koizumi remain supportive and he/Haruhi part under different circumstances.

Indirectly, this does make Haruhi responsible, unfortunately.  Still, that works much better than her wishing it to work out that way, versus things just turning out that way.
Quote from: Muphrid on September 26, 2011, 03:38:44 AMOh, okay, Haruhi thinks 'Auntie' refers to Kyon's wife.
Haruhi seems to have a strange interest in Kyon's romantic partner/lack thereof, yes....

Does this need to be made more obvious, here?
Quote from: Muphrid on September 26, 2011, 03:38:44 AM
Eh, I do like the specificity of it.  Up to you.
Well, that's all the convincing I need to make it just 'daikon'. ;)
Quote from: Muphrid on September 26, 2011, 03:38:44 AMGlad to be of assistance.
Thanks again; I've rewritten chapter 2 as per Sarsaparilla's comments, and hope to have that posted this evening. :)

Edit: Revised chapter two in the first post.
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~

sarsaparilla

Quote from: Brian on September 27, 2011, 12:49:59 AMIndirectly, this does make Haruhi responsible, unfortunately.

After the second reading I actually disagree about the responsibility part. Haruhi's powers may be the direct cause of the end result but they do that just by existing, not by making any active effort to the effect. Hence, if anybody, I can only keep Koizumi responsible for his own actions and decisions (because he knew what he was getting into), and their eventual consequences.

Quote from: Brian on September 27, 2011, 12:49:59 AMHaruhi seems to have a strange interest in Kyon's romantic partner/lack thereof, yes....

Does this need to be made more obvious, here?

For whatever it's worth, I noticed it on the first reading but it wasn't unnaturally salient, so it might be on the right level already.

Quote from: Brian on September 27, 2011, 12:49:59 AMRevised chapter two in the first post.

While a relatively small change, it's still a stark contrast to the previous version. I must admit that the very idea of Haruhi dating Koizumi makes me feel ... uncomfortable, but the sympathy that is spent on Koizumi actually comes around and makes both Kyon and Haruhi more sympathetic in this chapter.

I must admit that by now I'm completely hooked on this story and can hardly wait for the next part.

Brian

Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 27, 2011, 02:19:45 AMAfter the second reading I actually disagree about the responsibility part. Haruhi's powers may be the direct cause of the end result but they do that just by existing, not by making any active effort to the effect. Hence, if anybody, I can only keep Koizumi responsible for his own actions and decisions (because he knew what he was getting into), and their eventual consequences.
Y...es.  This seems to be in keeping with my habit of occasionally saying incredibly stupid things. >.>

I didn't like the idea of Haruhi being responsible once you pointed it out as something she wouldn't do, so when I actually sat down to do the rewrite, I did my best to make sure it didn't come across that way.  It seems that worked, so I'm glad for that.
Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 27, 2011, 02:19:45 AMFor whatever it's worth, I noticed it on the first reading but it wasn't unnaturally salient, so it might be on the right level already.
Aces!  Something I can leave unrevised. :D
Quote from: sarsaparilla on September 27, 2011, 02:19:45 AMI must admit that by now I'm completely hooked on this story and can hardly wait for the next part.
Thanks again for the suggestion -- I'll start work on chapter three ... eh, after I sleep. >_>;;

In the meantime, I hope I can keep the ending from being a letdown to you, then.

Incidentally, did you draw that Sasaki avatar yourself?  It's very cute. :)
I handle other fanfic authors Nanoha-style.  Grit those teeth!  C&C incoming!
Prepare to be befriended!

~exploding tag~