[NGE] The Coming of the First Ones

[Muphrid]

Post-series, something I've been working on as a side project.

[Dracos]

Just for awareness:  What branch of NGE is this off of?

That might (ignoring the elegant starter style) be a good thing to find a way to mention early as NGE (like Tenchi) has so many different fairly varied original tales, and as a post story, it's important to know which one we're looking at following.

[Muphrid]

Right, this should be after End of Evangelion. So, the relevant background ought to be episodes 1-24 of the TV series plus that.

[Dracos]

Mmm...

Asuka seems surprisingly mellow.  But then there's many good narrative reasons for that, not the least of which being years of maturity.

The Old Ones being Chthulian invaders from beyond the stars is not an uncommon blend with Evangelion, but it's also not a bad one at all.  The subtone of human suffering and starvation though is a bit odd, almost a distraction from it.  But it is early, and hard to see.

Overall, I would keep reading. :)  It's not a bad first chapter and does a good job of setting the tone for the world and a story that may take place in it.  It establishes a number of active characters and leaves no doubt of our protagonist.  Question is left of course what in the world would Shinji Ikari be able to do against metaphysical god-things coming from beyond the stars without having a giant god-thing killing mecha, but hey, just because it's not there yet, doesn't rule it out.

Edit:
I know what bothers me enough to quibble a bit.

There's a slight disconnect between personal individuality in the fic and the setting.  While civilization exists, it's experiencing a number of things that would normally incite riots or demand strict group action in order to deal with.  The individuality to go and pursue any interesting skill and deliver it or even the opportunity to do advanced genetics research relies upon the basic necessities being trivially available and covered.  If large numbers of people are struggling to acquire food, there would be a base intolerance for there being such idle pursuits.  Sure, a place to live would be guarenteed, and with mere hundreds of thousands possibly in japan, acquiring and providing enough food shouldn't be difficult with modern tools available, but if it was difficult, the need for food would seem to be a paramount focus of effort.

It's easy enough to have this kind of idle pursuit area where Food and Shelter are covered trivially, and for most people the lacking is Purpose.  As a thought that might fit better.  But with Food and distribution of such being a real problem, it seems like it'd be hard put to support people living in penthouse apartments or doing advanced science research.  Even military stuff.

The same kind of scene could easily cover though folks coming newly from the sea.

Anyhow, not a big thing, but to note.

[JonBob]

I'll go ahead and do a sort of Murphid-style response where I summarize what I'm getting from the story. It probably won't be much of a normal C&C

Spoiler: ShowHide

Shinji relates his woes of being _that boy_ since he was the first. He's taking a trip to meet and interview a guy (Nakamura) about his entry into and subsequent leaving of the sea of LCL. In particular, Shinji's there to get information on what Nakamura saw as he was convinced to leave the sea of souls: a girl standing over the water. From the context and clues, you can infer that it is Rei they are talking about. It appears that Shinji has been looking for her.

We finally get context of the setting: 2 years after he left the sea. We also get more details of the world, that it has been preserved while everyone was in the sea. Shinji believes it is Rei. Shinji meets a girl on a train who is a member of the Cult of Lilith, who believe Rei is a benevolent, divine being.

Next we see how Shinji's daily life is lived out. He's the object of a lot of hatred for being the first to leave the sea of souls, which comes in the form of lots of mail. He's dropped out of school because he receives too much attention as the first. He enjoys cooking and tried to be a cook at a shelter once, but that opened his eyes to issues of poverty and despair that's still going on in the world and the blind eyes of the authorities. Eventually, he had to leave due to an incident involving him and word of his presence there.

More world-building, with an emphasis on international affairs and issues with production of foods and goods.

Shinji is visiting a laboratory with some meals, and we find out that Asuka is working there. She's been there for a long time that days and tends to get caught up in her work. We also learn that they are dating and a kiss is interrupted by Asuka's mom! She teases them and they leave to have dinner. Asuka's mom had suddenly shown up, and it seemed to revitalize Asuka.

Some dinner conversation between Shinji and Asuka, and the conversation gets around to Rei and why he's looking for her. There's also flirting and some "adult activities."

Shinji goes home alone and wakes up alone. Next day he meets up with Misato (since anyone else will ignore him) to try and get the government to acknowledge the existence of Rei, but they won't release the information since it would cause more harm than good. Shinji doesn't have a good response to why they should prove Rei's alive, so he goes to the site of Tokyo-3 where there is a Cult of Lilith gathering. Shinji does a little soul searching and heads back towards home. On the way there he is "summoned" by Rei, who explains to him that there are beings "the First Ones" who want mankind to return to to the sea. She needs his help to beat them back.

Ok, so overall, you've established the setting where there is a lot of despair and conflict, but mankind is still trying to live outside the sea. Shinji doesn't really have a purpose, so he wanders. And then Rei "returns" with a new disaster on the horizon. It looks like a good setup. I also like how you're looking pretty closely at Shinji without becoming too introspective.

[Muphrid]

The Old Ones being Chthulian invaders from beyond the stars is not an uncommon blend with Evangelion, but it's also not a bad one at all.  The subtone of human suffering and starvation though is a bit odd, almost a distraction from it.  But it is early, and hard to see.

Overall, I would keep reading. :)  It's not a bad first chapter and does a good job of setting the tone for the world and a story that may take place in it.  It establishes a number of active characters and leaves no doubt of our protagonist.  Question is left of course what in the world would Shinji Ikari be able to do against metaphysical god-things coming from beyond the stars without having a giant god-thing killing mecha, but hey, just because it's not there yet, doesn't rule it out.

While there is a similarity to Lovecraft, I don't give the impression that I'm explicitly borrowing from him, do I?  Because if so, that wasn't my intention, and I may need to change the language a bit to try to downplay anything that could lead people to think so.

I know what bothers me enough to quibble a bit.

There's a slight disconnect between personal individuality in the fic and the setting.  While civilization exists, it's experiencing a number of things that would normally incite riots or demand strict group action in order to deal with.  The individuality to go and pursue any interesting skill and deliver it or even the opportunity to do advanced genetics research relies upon the basic necessities being trivially available and covered.  If large numbers of people are struggling to acquire food, there would be a base intolerance for there being such idle pursuits.  Sure, a place to live would be guarenteed, and with mere hundreds of thousands possibly in japan, acquiring and providing enough food shouldn't be difficult with modern tools available, but if it was difficult, the need for food would seem to be a paramount focus of effort.

It's easy enough to have this kind of idle pursuit area where Food and Shelter are covered trivially, and for most people the lacking is Purpose.  As a thought that might fit better.  But with Food and distribution of such being a real problem, it seems like it'd be hard put to support people living in penthouse apartments or doing advanced science research.  Even military stuff.

The same kind of scene could easily cover though folks coming newly from the sea.

Anyhow, not a big thing, but to note.

You're absolutely right; a question of purpose as a whole fits much better--why people should go back to slaving away as they had before and such.  I think this is something I can incorporate in a revision.  Shelter ought to be plentiful with a lot of people gone.  Food shortages I think are reasonable, but it could stand more language about rationing and stuff and maybe could be seen more as a side-effect of lack of purpose, of people refusing to go back to old jobs because they've been so transformed.


JonBob:  I think you've hit all the major points, so I'm encouraged to see most things came across as they should.  I'm glad the focus on Shinji isn't uncomfortably close, too.  Thank you both for your thoughts.  I think with Dracos's suggestion in particular, this can be tightened up a little bit and feel right.

[Dracos]

While there is a similarity to Lovecraft, I don't give the impression that I'm explicitly borrowing from him, do I?  Because if so, that wasn't my intention, and I may need to change the language a bit to try to downplay anything that could lead people to think so.

Mmm.  Well, I think in this case it is unavoidable.  When you're dealing with ancient alien invaders from beyond the stars desiring the abolition of humanity into a meaningless sea, you're gonna have folks draw parallels.  I wouldn't rush it so much as just be aware that's going to happen.

[alethiophile]

Looks interesting. I'm (very) cruddy at C&C on a higher level than typos, and none of those jumped out at me, so I'll just say I like it so far.

[Oroboro]

As a note, most of my NGE knowledge comes from TVTropes.

Anyway, I enjoyed this quite a bit. Honestly, sans the hook at the end, the whole thing could stand as a oneshot, just as a slow, melancholic piece.

I will say that the ending hook came a bit suddenly. Maybe you can slip in a little foreshadowing throughout the story that something is wrong? Other unexplained things Shinji's noticed while searching for Rei, or something.

Looking forward to seeing where this goes, in any case.

[Muphrid]

Indeed, that's one of the things that's been bugging me over the last few days.  The best I can think of is someone barging into the ocean, claiming the people from the sky told him to dissolve there.  You're right that at present, it lacks the sense that everything will connect and we'll get to plot (as opposed to setting the scene and scenery).  Not quite sure what else to do on that point yet.

[Muphrid]

All right, this revision addresses makes several changes, the principal of which are listed below:

Spoiler: ShowHide

1) References to food shortages being a primary stressor on this society have been largely excised; lack of direction and purpose should be a more prominent and consistent theme throughout.
2) The influence of the First Ones has been expanded to lessen the unexpectedness of the hook at the end of the chapter.  These changes include:
2a) Rewriting portions of the first scene.  Nakamura's wife is now alive thought Instrumentality and commits suicide by wading into the ocean, having been told by "voices that make no sound" to do so.
2b) The scene with a gunman trying to kill Shinji is expanded, and in particular, he feels an inexorable pull leading him to Shinji even as Shinji hides.
2c) Shinji "hears" the same voices and feels the same pull while waiting at the Square for Misato, narrowly avoiding drowning himself in a fountain.
2d) Shinji feels more of a pull during the final scene, and it should be more abundantly clear that the First Ones were trying to throw him into traffic to get him killed.  This also means Rei's appearance scene is restructured somewhat.

Whew.  So this has ballooned a bit.  It was my hope, however, that these changes wouldn't make the chapter too dour or foreboding.  Overall, I was happy with the growth Shinji had in recognizing that he needed to find something meaningful to do and not being unduly stressed over it. I briefly considered having Shinji's focus go solely to the mystery of the silent voices and such, but I thought that would change a lot of the tenor of the story.

Once again, I appreciate all the help that's been given so far.

Edit: and now, another possibility.  Revision 8...

Spoiler: ShowHide

...rewrites the ending once more, trying to avoid some of Rei's infodump in favor of something more organic?  Eh, it still involves someone or something telling Shinji what he needs to know to make sense of this.  If this isn't received well, I can consider ending this one at "Ayanami, you saved me again...but from what?" and giving no hint at all here what the answer to that question is, not until the next chapter anyway.

[JonBob]

R5 C&C

That they knew not who he was thanks to the impenetrable anonymity of computers and servers was for his protection, if nothing else.

Awkward. "Thanks to the imprenetrable anonymity of computers and servers they didn't know who he was and that afforded him protection, if nothing else".

My wife is dead now. That resolve we gained two years ago and reclaimed this house, didn't last.

Missing something. "That resolve we gained two years ago to rebuild our lives and reclaim this house didn't last."

If he baked bread for a village that could no longer grow enough grain, what was he to bake instead? Though many adapted, adopting new pursuits and vocations, the rest meandered through the new world, looking for new direction, new purpose, and found all avenues closed to them.

Not sure about the first sentence. He's baking bread, but he's not baking bread? In the second, adapted->adopting is a bit repetitive, and the end doesn't flow as well as possible. "Though many adapated, learning new pursuits and vocations, the rest meandered through the new world looking for a new direction, a new purpose, and found all avenues closed to them."


Overall, an interesting new tone. A lot more about psychological survival than physical survival. Also, unless all 5 of the First Ones are focusing on Shinji, he's doesn't seem quite strong enough to help beat back these guys.

R8 C&C

telling the tales of planets and systems that could time might already have snuffed out.

Remove the "could"?


Another interesting change. This version, though, gives me more Bokurano vibes, with human interference rather than Angelic or Cthlulian.

[Muphrid]

Thanks for the help, JonBob.  Based on your comments here and on IRC, I've rewritten the ending once again, trying to make it feel a little more alien and strange.  I think between 5, 8, and 9, I've hit all the bases as far as an ending that reveals the intentions of the First Ones and makes the future of the story clear.  The only alternative I can consider is one where the mystery of what they are and what's been happening to Shinji is kept intact to be more slowly revealed later.  Again, any guidance that can be provided is much appreciated; I apologize if this seems a bit too much like a shotgunned approach.  Since this is the first chapter, nailing every aspect of it seems all the more critical to me.

[JonBob]

He felt blindly on the ground, unwilling to look, and found warm, freely-flowing liquid seeping into the earth.

Right after "POP!" you almost think the second word should be "fell" and it creates a temporary dissonance.

orange-red fluid seeped out, and of neither driver was a trace left

"orange-red fluid seeped out and there was no trace of either driver."


Even after a second reading, it's not hugely clear (at least to me) that the LCL was all a vision. Maybe when you mention the "where another paramedic was tending to the wounded driver" you could throw in something about the driver being whole and non-LCL.

The last two lines are pretty epic, but might come across as cheesy as well. If so, you might be able to get rid of them/integrate them somewhere else in the story. Also, "the man chose to resist" are you intentionally trying to make a contrast with "the boy"?

As for the tone and direction of the ending, I think it gets across the whole "this thing is out to get us and there's no way to convince it otherwise".

[Muphrid]

Right after "POP!" you almost think the second word should be "fell" and it creates a temporary dissonance.

Might go with searched then.

Even after a second reading, it's not hugely clear (at least to me) that the LCL was all a vision. Maybe when you mention the "where another paramedic was tending to the wounded driver" you could throw in something about the driver being whole and non-LCL.

The last two lines are pretty epic, but might come across as cheesy as well. If so, you might be able to get rid of them/integrate them somewhere else in the story. Also, "the man chose to resist" are you intentionally trying to make a contrast with "the boy"?

As for the tone and direction of the ending, I think it gets across the whole "this thing is out to get us and there's no way to convince it otherwise".

Will do about the truck driver.  I wish I'd been clever enough to come up with "the boy" vs. "the man", but what really happened there was I originally had written "the first man" and thought that the repetition of first might not sit well.  I'd intended to say, "It was also the day that man chose to resist."  Clearly a different intention, though the contrast you thought I was going for does seem pretty attractive.  At any rate, I'm glad the general thrust of this version of the ending seems to feel right, so barring other thoughts on the matter, this is probably what I'll go with.  Thanks again.

Edit: revision A cleans up some typoes and incomplete sentences and ought to be the final version.