General discussion/opinions

[Anastasia]

I'd like to encourage a chance for general discussion and opninoning. I'll start, but feel free to reply to this or go off on another tangent altogether if you want. By all means, do so.

The one thing I come away liking each week is the party dynamic. Both on the battlefield and off each PC is settling into a specific roll; this is fun to watch and to DM around. Off field it's a pretty good give and take between Saul and Elaine being the strongest personalities, with Seryf being the quiet girl in the background, Darius being big mouthed but not that huge a noisemaker, and Gavin being a saner if sometimes overwhelmed voice.

On field, it's tank/swords/swords/tiger/magical guy/odds and ends. I'll leave you to guess on who each is, since it's rather obvious, but it works. While there is some overlap with Seryf and Darius, each PC has a fairly good role in the dirtier aspect of adventuring. This is part of what made the previous session's splitting up so interesting, it made groups rely on themselves instead of parts of the machine.

Not that being a good team is bad, it just highlighted the dual adventures better.

[Merc]

I take it I'm the "odds and ends"? =p

Anyhoo...Party dynamic is fun. It has a family dynamic of sorts for Elaine. How she considers them right now:

Saul = Big brother who knows everything, the person to ask for advice on stuff, and berate/tease when he does something stupid.
Seryf = Big cool sister type, sorta like Sakaki (with a pinch of bloodthirstyness!) from Azumanga. Not a hero worship relationship, just Elaine considers her someone who's sorta neat and fairly collected.
Darius = annoying younger brother (even if he is older) who can do nice things every now and then.
Gavin = best guy friend, fun to hang around, feel safe around.

Doing a few more individual/paired adventures in different sets would be interesting, yeah.

[Dracos]

Playing Gavin has been a little odd lately.  Imagined him more in a more human dominated setting, so it's been a little odd dancing off in elf/magic land and coming up with meaningful things to say in such an environment.  In general as an RPer, I tend not to interleave too much if I see something as someone elses role, so I've sort of taken a step further back talking wise of late along that, with it being more appropriate for elves to talk to elves, bards to bards, and mages to mages in such.  Don't mind it being so, as I understand it wavers between things, though I hope we get some more human land quests type deals(such as with the local constable/knights at o'cul something) as those are fun and more natural for RPing Gavin in.  I admit though I've also been a bit distracted in that vein when playing.  ADD and all that, which has weakened my general posting a bit.  That I think, more than anything, has really contributed to gavin coming across as more quiet/overwhelmed.  Being distracted for a couple minutes between comments pretty much results in others taking the lead there.  Something I've got to work on a bit.  Gavin though is also supposed to be somewhat of a non-boisterous character.  More formal and such in his general behaviour following the type of heritage he's coming from and I sort of think that's coming out somewhat.  Even if 'as saner' =P

As far as battle, I'm having fun.  It's gone pretty well along my plan of being a warrior/defensive tank.  Seryf's fitting well into the primary damage dealer.  I think Darius feels the most awkward in battle in my mind, largely because he sort of feels like an unlucky Seryf, built not as strongly along that vein.  The general separation in combat of him and Serith tends to push towards this...  They feel less like a unified front and more like two separate characters acting.  I know Serith's taking a liking to Seryf, but it's just something that I feel weakens his character a bit.  There's just not been a terribly strong sense coming across as "We're partners".  It'd be nice seeing that partnership strenghtened on screen (I know there's some stuff that goes back and forth) both in battle and out.  Maybe something like having them go on the same action count or having Darius directly control her during battle or something.  In other words, Serith, by feeling like a completely separate party member, tends to weaken Darius' role in the party in my mind.  His big shtick is that he's this beast-tamer/warrior/savage dude.  He's not been savage, so that's really out.  He's neither the best at attacking or at defending or at being neat while fighting (Going to Seryf, Myself, and Elaine to fill those roles).  So what he really has left to shine with is "Darius, beast-tamer" type deal.  But that's not been felt much.  Instead it feels like, and been described as, him just being a member of Serith's pack which seems to be quickly growing to cover the party as well.  Not that I see it wrong with Serith being more of a character, it just doesn't leave much to Iddy if his big specialty is so separated from him.  Right now even the communication from Serith feels more like Serith using him than Serith being part of his character.  If this isn't going to happen...perhaps more stuff tied in with his background, his tribal heritage, etc, would help him stand out better.  More opportunity to pull that into light.  Not that I'm a huge fan of tribal antics, but something to make his character less of 'lesser Seryf' and more of a 'Darius, something special'.

 Saul as a mage has felt a little disadvantaged...  more because Rat's playing into unconsciousness than anything else.  He just doesn't feel like he's gotten much chance to shine since his early sleep antics.  Maybe it's just me.  I haven't actually felt him being that strong a personality.  Elaine, sure, but not saul that much.

Elaine's been a bit of the star, but that's not unexpected.  By playing an exuberant bard/swordgirl character, it's hard to compete in terms of room for antics.  It's a good character choice.  I just sort of expect that Elaine's going to have something to say on almost everything more than anyone else largely because everything can be phrased in terms of her characters desire for tales to tell.  In battle and out she's had a fun role to play and is enjoyable to interact with.  Was glad to have her as partner in the troll antics, even if she sort of got skewered repeatedly =).

Hum, there's my blather. =)  Back to writing reviews.

Dracos

[Merc]

The general separation in combat of him and Serith tends to push towards this... They feel less like a unified front and more like two separate characters acting. I know Serith's taking a liking to Seryf, but it's just something that I feel weakens his character a bit. There's just not been a terribly strong sense coming across as "We're partners".

Agreed. Outside of combat, the two do have the partners/friends thing, but in battle...there's really just not that image. They're entirely separate characters, it feels more like being in one of those old delphi games where the GM was also one of the party characters, not an extension of Darius. Yeah, she -should- have her own personality, but she's still part of what should make him unique, and it doesn't really come up much. The battle sequences don't show the teamwork that should be there.

Outside of fights it's great. You can sort of see that relationship when Darius got warned of the electric door, or the roughhousing/prank stuff, but in the main window, since we don't see the mental conversations, that connection just isn't as apparent in battle at least. Do they even -happen- in battle at that, really? I didn't get any impression of that, which shows how disjointed that relationship gets in battle.

I agree that they should probably go on the same count or just something that gives the impression that they're working together. Like say Darius setting up an attack to leave the opponent open to an unexpected pounce attack from the side or some such. Some sort of cooperation between their attacks. Use that mental link to set up plans together where they set each other up for better attacks against the opponent.

If he keeps getting bad rolls, while Serith gets the good ones, use that to the advantage! Make Darius do something like smirk, like he -planned- to miss while distracting them from the PAINFUL claws and jaws that are Serith's. Something to that effect. They're a team, one's victory is the other's victory too.

Saul as a mage has felt a little disadvantaged... more because Rat's playing into unconsciousness than anything else. He just doesn't feel like he's gotten much chance to shine since his early sleep antics. Maybe it's just me. I haven't actually felt him being that strong a personality. Elaine, sure, but not saul that much.

Hrm...I agree that he hasn't really shined since the sleep antics in battle, or dealing with the dragon, but outside of battle he's still a very strong personality. He did shine a bit more again with the wands episode, though it was admittedly in a negative fashion of sorts. Mostly due to bad rolling really. He's also had bad luck with the cure light wounds, so he doesn't look that great when he's trying to help as a healer, and since he can't convert spells like in 3E, that kinda screws up the priest side of him.

Elaine's been a bit of the star, but that's not unexpected. By playing an exuberant bard/swordgirl character, it's hard to compete in terms of room for antics. It's a good character choice. I just sort of expect that Elaine's going to have something to say on almost everything more than anyone else largely because everything can be phrased in terms of her characters desire for tales to tell. In battle and out she's had a fun role to play and is enjoyable to interact with. Was glad to have her as partner in the troll antics, even if she sort of got skewered repeatedly =)

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Playing Elaine is an utter -blast-. I usually play characters a lot more down key, sort of like Seryf gets played at times I guess, so it's a fun change. And while Elaine does have a word to say on any matter if she really wants to, she's also not one to take charge/leadership, so when the responsible talk comes up, she kinda sputters out distractedly, unless she can redirect the conversation (like asking Seryf and Darius about their gifts while Gavin and Saul planned).

[Iron Dragoon]

I agree with everything so far..

Gavin really has been pretty much out of place with the areas we've been going to.. Part of that in the last adventure was the feeling I got from the NPC elfs.. It seemed like they kinda blew him off.. The fact that we have a Knight-Errant with us really hasn't seem to made any type of impact on the NPC's.. Generally Knight-Errants are greeted with cheers and looked up to. Wandering Knights are rare, and the source of a -lot- of stories in the past of things like what happened in the first adventure. One shows up, noses out something no one else ever expected, and did so for the benefit of all. The.. I dunno.. Mysticism and ledgendary reputation of a Knight-Errant hasn't really been there.. Gavin feels, to me, to be viewed as more of a.. Town Guard or just a regular, every day fighter that's wandering around, instead of the pillar Justice and Honor that he should be viewed as..

Saul's already been pretty much hit on squarely.. Outside of RPing, he's really not had anything to do besides heal.. He hasn't really had a chance to show off the mage side of his character, or the versatility of his combination.. Instead of being a mage that can heal somewhat, he's been a cleric that -knows- about mage stuff, but doesn't do it.

Elaine's been hit on pretty well, too.. RPing she's great, and in combat she does the fancy stuff, which is what it should be like.. The only thing about her that I feel Merc's been weak on so far is the actual job of being a Bard.. I know she's a blade, and not a straight up Bard, but so far she hasn't really performed in any bardic manner.. No real story telling sessions, nothing to really entrance a tavern, nothing to really cause the reaction in a town that a Bard normally does.. Which is generally 'A Bard?! Which tavern? I'll be there tonight! I can't wait to hear her tales and music!' Bards, like Knights, tend to be recieved with a certian amount of hub-bub and flare in the town, especially the ones we've been to, where they're rural and Bards are generally not seen on a constant basis. Also, I've seen a distinct *lack* of her doing anything with the party's story. I've seen no obvious attempts of her recording anything, practicing how to recite the story, working it into song or anything.. This is the fourth adventure, she should have at least two or three verses in her song by now, damn it =D

Seryf, I agree, has been shifted more into a 'big sister' role for pretty much the entire group that I can see. She's quiet, reflective, and 'wise' to a degree. Her humor is generally really well placed, and so is her personality. In combat she plays her set up *really* well. She's an impressive sight to behold. As far as her RP thing goes.. Except for how she gets along with Serith, so far she doesn't really feel like a Ranger all the way.. She feels more like a Warrior who likes the forest instead of a 'Nature's Protector' or a Forrest Warden.. I'll grant, this is partly because she hasn't had many chances to play it off since we've been focused mostly in towns. But trying to work it in should be in there.. For example, Darius -shouldn't- really be hunting too much, Seryf should (even though it's only for RP stuff when I do..), and she should take Serith with her, also. I don't really know how to fix it or make it better, so that she has more chances to really have her class stand out instead of her Sword, so I can't offer up much on it..

Darius.. Yes, you've all got it pegged pretty much, too.. Outside of combat the relationship with Serith is apparent, but it's also somewhat flawed a little by her seeming to like Seryf more than Darius.. While Darius certianly has no probably with Serith going to hang out with the other party members, she shouldn't be going to Seryf exclusively, or as often as she does.. To the point where it's more common to see her at Seryf's side than at mine. Also, RP for Darius has been.. Awkward.. The party memebers are generally alright, and I admit I play him as 'smarter' than he probably should be, but not *too* much smarter, I think.. And NPC reactions, again, aren't really there.. I tried to work in his general uncomfortableness in this last adventure with how he kinda withdrew from the party and the other elves.. I haven't really had much chance to play on the fact that Darius *is* from a reclusive tribe, that even there he stood out as a half-elf in a human tribe, that he's an elite of his tribe.. I've tried to keep him somewhat seperate from both the human and elf communities, but it hasn't been easy.. NPC dislike seems to be directed at Serith instead of at both of us.. I've also been waiting for 'elf' things to happen, sort of the way they're considered 'graceful' and all that hokey stuff to show how uncultured he is and just how diffrent than he is, but I haven't seen many chances to do it.

As far as combat goes, something -does- need to be done about it.. In combat, we *are* seperate characters instead of a team.. This is my fault mainly because I don't really give Dune any direction about it, but at the same time, it's hard to take advantage of anything either one of us does when there's one or more people seperating our turns. By the time anything we could do anything to take advantage of it, it's already been changed by the actions of those who went in-between us. I think Drac had it right, we both need to go on the same turn, and Dune and I need to interact more on the combat side, though I don't know how well it will work going back and forth between us.. The game moves slow enough, we don't need to have a discussion about Darius and Serith working every combat round.. Also, our paired combat is *extremely* weak.. Mounted combat looks like a joke to me.. From what I can see, there's almost -no- benefit to my being mounted.. I get no real bonuses, and neither does Serith.. In fact, it *hurts* Serith since she can't move and attack in a round, unlike if I were dismounted.. Merc had one good example in chat:

<Merc> cause I would have recommended something like Serith pouncing while you're on for her attack, and while the opponent is underneath, you slide the scimitars off her sides and underneath her to stab at the trapped body

We need to do things like that.. Serith and I should know *exactly* what the other is doing, so Serith should be doing things like clamping down on an arm and I use the opening of that side of the body not being defended to make an attack there. It needs to go both ways, too though. I need to start moving around and doing things like hamstringing people, tripping them up, or disarming them, and then letting Serith go for the take down or finish.. But with us going at diffrent times, so far it's just been impossible.. We also need to start using tatics between us, again as Merc said, we should be flanking the target when it's focused on one of us. Basically, Dune and I need to just sit down and figure it out, since Wizards of the Coast didn't seem to in any book I've seen so far =p

Anyway, over all, the game is going great.. I'm having fun, the group works well, the personalities are diffrent enough to make a fun set of reactions to things, and we're pretty much kicking ass.

[Anastasia]

Playing Gavin has been a little odd lately. Imagined him more in a more human dominated setting, so it's been a little odd dancing off in elf/magic land and coming up with meaningful things to say in such an environment. In general as an RPer, I tend not to interleave too much if I see something as someone elses role, so I've sort of taken a step further back talking wise of late along that, with it being more appropriate for elves to talk to elves, bards to bards, and mages to mages in such. Don't mind it being so, as I understand it wavers between things, though I hope we get some more human land quests type deals(such as with the local constable/knights at o'cul something) as those are fun and more natural for RPing Gavin in. I admit though I've also been a bit distracted in that vein when playing. ADD and all that, which has weakened my general posting a bit. That I think, more than anything, has really contributed to gavin coming across as more quiet/overwhelmed. Being distracted for a couple minutes between comments pretty much results in others taking the lead there. Something I've got to work on a bit. Gavin though is also supposed to be somewhat of a non-boisterous character. More formal and such in his general behaviour following the type of heritage he's coming from and I sort of think that's coming out somewhat. Even if 'as saner' =P

Yeah. As far as the elf stuff goes; the Team Elf comments and jive made me want to notch things on that pole before the possible plot for awhile dictates a different setting. That said? You're probably right about a lot of it, and getting back into familiar waters will probably help.

Hm.

I'll elaborate on this more and get to the other stuff(Serith) later, when I'm not home sick with a vicious headache.

[Dracos]

I agree with everything so far..

Gavin really has been pretty much out of place with the areas we've been going to.. Part of that in the last adventure was the feeling I got from the NPC elfs.. It seemed like they kinda blew him off.. The fact that we have a Knight-Errant with us really hasn't seem to made any type of impact on the NPC's.. Generally Knight-Errants are greeted with cheers and looked up to. Wandering Knights are rare, and the source of a -lot- of stories in the past of things like what happened in the first adventure. One shows up, noses out something no one else ever expected, and did so for the benefit of all. The.. I dunno.. Mysticism and ledgendary reputation of a Knight-Errant hasn't really been there.. Gavin feels, to me, to be viewed as more of a.. Town Guard or just a regular, every day fighter that's wandering around, instead of the pillar Justice and Honor that he should be viewed as..

He's very right on this note.  This sort of thing would make Gavin a hell of a lot easier to RP with random NPCs.  Gavin is dressed up, perpetually, in bright knight's garb.  He wears the symbols over his armor and keeps that pretty polished and all.  He is meant to be sort of a symbol as he's traveling about.  If these ever got damaged, he'd likely, quickly, be paying to have replacements made because that's what he's expected to garb himself as a member of the Knighthood.  A separation between the casual town guard and the knighthood (a tier above at minimum) is nice and helps towards this.

Dracos

[Dracos]

Addendum:

Yeah, I resisted because I often focus on this but... Keep an eye on Seryf's xp.  She got sort of hardlined this last game despite being the focus xp wise.  Yeah, I guess the sword balances it, but I'd like to not have someone in our party end up two levels back total.  We've got a lot of folks with 4 and me and seryf at 3, which is fine, except Seryf is some 2000 abouts xp behind the rest of the party...which is huge (a full two adventures worth) and I'm not quite sure how she got that far back.

Dracos

[Anastasia]

Addendum:

Yeah, I resisted because I often focus on this but... Keep an eye on Seryf's xp.  She got sort of hardlined this last game despite being the focus xp wise.  Yeah, I guess the sword balances it, but I'd like to not have someone in our party end up two levels back total.  We've got a lot of folks with 4 and me and seryf at 3, which is fine, except Seryf is some 2000 abouts xp behind the rest of the party...which is huge (a full two adventures worth) and I'm not quite sure how she got that far back.

Dracos

Agreed. It was because she only got one troll and the rest of you got two trolls on your killsheet. They're worth a lot, and the rest is odds and ends; I recall her not doing well on bonus EXP one adventure. Part of this works well because she did get two fairly useful magical items, further since 2000 EXP is quite make upable, moreso as the EXP curve increases.

On a related note because it came up and I may as well hit it now, I am looking to increase the EXP curve a tad bit. Due to the Weekly nature of this game and the fact that each adventure takes 2-4 sessions, I'd rather up it slightly so you aren't level 2 or 3 for four months. I think it worked well in this case, since you got a challenging set of encounters and rewarded well for your victories. Proportionally it's a tad out of whack, but you were also more in danger from these trolls than anything else you've fought so far. (The dragon doesn't count since you didn't -fight- it. <_<)

[Anastasia]

I agree with everything so far..

Gavin really has been pretty much out of place with the areas we've been going to.. Part of that in the last adventure was the feeling I got from the NPC elfs.. It seemed like they kinda blew him off.. The fact that we have a Knight-Errant with us really hasn't seem to made any type of impact on the NPC's.. Generally Knight-Errants are greeted with cheers and looked up to. Wandering Knights are rare, and the source of a -lot- of stories in the past of things like what happened in the first adventure. One shows up, noses out something no one else ever expected, and did so for the benefit of all. The.. I dunno.. Mysticism and ledgendary reputation of a Knight-Errant hasn't really been there.. Gavin feels, to me, to be viewed as more of a.. Town Guard or just a regular, every day fighter that's wandering around, instead of the pillar Justice and Honor that he should be viewed as..

He's very right on this note.  This sort of thing would make Gavin a hell of a lot easier to RP with random NPCs.  Gavin is dressed up, perpetually, in bright knight's garb.  He wears the symbols over his armor and keeps that pretty polished and all.  He is meant to be sort of a symbol as he's traveling about.  If these ever got damaged, he'd likely, quickly, be paying to have replacements made because that's what he's expected to garb himself as a member of the Knighthood.  A separation between the casual town guard and the knighthood (a tier above at minimum) is nice and helps towards this.

Dracos

Mmmm.

Yes, that's a valid point. Looking back on it you have more of a point - while Silvat's Reach greeted Gavin fairly well(Albiet under the circumstances they were in), you're probably..mmm. On thinking about it, I dunno. The bandit group reacted to Gavin as bandits would be likely to(Not good!), you were received well enough in Cup'o'Orial, albiet in a restrained sort of way. That's what I was aiming for, since it's a quiet, secure and mostly forgotten town with it's own knight hall. As for Demetrius, he's not likely to greet Gavin well under the circumstances; Gavin's knighthood isn't a big deal to him as you can guess by now.

To be fair, the Elder Elf did greet Gavin well enough, but be it a Knight of the Crown or a paladin, a human warrior is going to be greeted with a reasonable respect there, but not fawned over. So I dunno, thinking about it. You have a point on one hand, but mmmm. Need to think this over, I reckon. I think part of this does tie into the above about Gavin being out of his element.

[Dracos]

Quite possibly.  I don't feel as strongly as iddy did about being unknighted... more just saying "This kind of thought and stuff: Good, it's what my character is about"

Dracos

[Anastasia]

I take it I'm the "odds and ends"? =p

Anyhoo...Party dynamic is fun. It has a family dynamic of sorts for Elaine. How she considers them right now:

Saul = Big brother who knows everything, the person to ask for advice on stuff, and berate/tease when he does something stupid.
Seryf = Big cool sister type, sorta like Sakaki (with a pinch of bloodthirstyness!) from Azumanga. Not a hero worship relationship, just Elaine considers her someone who's sorta neat and fairly collected.
Darius = annoying younger brother (even if he is older) who can do nice things every now and then.
Gavin = best guy friend, fun to hang around, feel safe around.

Doing a few more individual/paired adventures in different sets would be interesting, yeah.

Not any time soon, but I'd like to keep individual stuff on tap if you go back to Paxburg. There's a fair bit I want to do there, and much of it can be done solo or in small groups. It's a little harder when you're out in the wilderness basically relying on yourselves. So yes, if nothing else, you and Saul need to have some time together! <_<

[Anastasia]

Quite possibly.  I don't feel as strongly as iddy did about being unknighted... more just saying "This kind of thought and stuff: Good, it's what my character is about"

Dracos

Mmm, yes. Let me clarify that I'm not outright disagreeing with Iddy as much as considering it and the context of each incident. There hasn't been a full knight's greeting yet, but I also think there hasn't been a case when it's quite right yet, if that makes any sense.

[Dracos]

I take it I'm the "odds and ends"? =p

Anyhoo...Party dynamic is fun. It has a family dynamic of sorts for Elaine. How she considers them right now:

Saul = Big brother who knows everything, the person to ask for advice on stuff, and berate/tease when he does something stupid.
Seryf = Big cool sister type, sorta like Sakaki (with a pinch of bloodthirstyness!) from Azumanga. Not a hero worship relationship, just Elaine considers her someone who's sorta neat and fairly collected.
Darius = annoying younger brother (even if he is older) who can do nice things every now and then.
Gavin = best guy friend, fun to hang around, feel safe around.

Doing a few more individual/paired adventures in different sets would be interesting, yeah.

Not any time soon, but I'd like to keep individual stuff on tap if you go back to Paxburg. There's a fair bit I want to do there, and much of it can be done solo or in small groups. It's a little harder when you're out in the wilderness basically relying on yourselves. So yes, if nothing else, you and Saul need to have some time together! <_<

No setting up Elaine as party slutty romantic~ =P

Dracos
BLANTANT OUT OF CONTEXT!

[Anastasia]

As far as battle, I'm having fun. It's gone pretty well along my plan of being a warrior/defensive tank. Seryf's fitting well into the primary damage dealer.

Yes. Gavin's flushing out quite well in this role. He's doing damage but not a prime damage dealer; Sir Gavin reminds me of the stereotyped heavy armor, mace wielding mounted knight. He's not going to do 9999 damage a round, but he's taking little to no damage and keeping the frailer party members safe. It's a good niche for him - a protector, basically, which fits in with his knight role.

Gavin SO should have tried to be the Ascendant with that angle! >_>