Random DM nagging.

[Anastasia]

Well, I wasn't part of the original B-anything, but I really enjoyed it. It took me a bit to figure out, but that's because I never played anything above 12 and had no background in the world.

I did enjoy learning about everything. Visiting old games with a new perspective sounds neat. I'd be interested.

Fair enough, thanks. I admittedly was aiming at people who played in B3 the first time, but this is a good contribution.

[Corwin]

I liked the closure. Succeeding was fun!

[Anastasia]

I liked the closure. Succeeding was fun!

It really was. I tend to set up big plots that don't always see payoff - but the point of the Shars, the Hells, all of that is to eventually try and triumph. Getting there makes it all the sweeter.

[Ebiris]

Yeah, I'd read over most of the old B3 logs before I asked about rejoining the game and it did recapture some of the old magic and rekindle my interest in the characters and plot. Felt good to get our win, even if it felt a bit rushed at the end there.

[Anastasia]

It was nice all around, yes.

Next pitch should be in a day or two. I was thinking this weekend, but that was overly optimistic.

[Anastasia]

I'm going to be talking about some of the underpinnings of the next mainline Balmuria game I want to run. This may or may not be the next game I run, it'll either be that or that homebrew system. I'm currently deciding about that, and as most of that end's meanderings are tied up on me hashing it out more, have some stuff about this end of it instead.

1. Nodes.

Rather than a tightly defined PC party, this game will be on a much larger scale. As high epic characters, the characters will either be divine themselves or the direct servants of divinity. As such they are either leaders or serving directly under them, and with either case great latitude to accomplish their goals. They will be expected to build up characters around them, a node that they're the center of. This is the way some games have drifted to previously (later B1, B3 in practice due to individual goals), so I think codifying it and using it to our advantage in a game with a vast scope would be to everyone's advantage.

Example (Deity): Alicia would be the head of her node and surrounded by NPCs like Syala, Marie, Antenora, Latha, Jessica and so on and so forth. Her entire thing is Sylica, which comes neatly packaged.
Example (Non-Deity): Moore would be tasked by Erathaol to accomplish various missions to advance Mount Celestia's agenda. He would be the head of his node and surrounded by NPCs from various places. Some would be new, some may be from B3 or other games and so on and so forth. He'd be establishing his own thing in Celestial as a direct agent of Erathaol.

2. Independence.

As mentioned before, at the level you'll be at, you'll have ways and means to get things done. You'll have little to no direct oversight, being the effective leader of your node. I'd expect people who are driven with goals, many self set to accomplish greater goals and deal with issues as they arise. Of course you'll get the occasional push anyway, but by and large you should be able to take a multiversal scale problem (example: Demogorgon is being a dick, kick him in the sack some and push him back) and work it through various sub goals and achievements.

Example (Deity): "Seira, this is Waukeen. Demogorgon's faithful have been attacking my temples on various Primes. Would you be a darling and breathe fiery vengeance on him? Thanks!"
Example (Deity): "Okay, let's fix this. Donald, go figure out why Demogorgon is doing this. Amaryl, get some forces ready for reprisals. Elle, do some divining to see if you can get a clue here. I'll go with Amaryl and lead the reprisals. Let's go!"
Example (Non-Deity): "Arachiel, Demogorgon is attacking many temples of various deities, most of them on the side of the righteous. Investigate this and report back to me."
Example (Non-Deity): "Hum. Well, I can get Josa and everyone to see if anyone's causing trouble around Balmuria. Romiel owes me a favor, so I can call on him for some aid. Oh! And that cute courre of Alicia's owes me too, she can give me any inside information they have. Let's go!"

By and large, PCs should be setting goals within the general framework they have and getting things done. Beyond the broad basics, this won't be a big, handholding sort of game. B3 had a fair bit of this within the general goal of freeing Lifasa, so this should be familiar enough.

3. Interconnectivity.

Now, so far I've talking about nodes and self focused groups without talking about how PCs would interact. As this is a game large in scope, I don't want the traditional, tight PC parties that require doing many things together, but a more flexible approach. However, that doesn't mean it's just multiple games with cameos. I would like ties to form and reasons to cooperate on various matters between the PCs and their nodes. It's a big enough multiverse that everyone should have things to do, as well as times when they want to get help from someone more involved in a particular area or for extra muscle. That should develop and be used when advantageous, to allow nodes to mix and interact as desires, but not in a mandatory nature.

Example (Deity): "Hm, Moore's been dealing with Mineral from what Ebony said. Rather than going in blind, I can ask him to go with Latha and vouch for her. That's a good idea."
Example (Non-Deity): "Hm, Seira deals with beating up Sharrans a lot. I could use some help smashing this cult temple...I could ask her for a favor to get Elle to help. That's a good idea."

All that said, that's a lot of words to basically say 'I want a game where each PC heads a group, does their thing and works with others as needed'. That's how games of ours tend to go, so I think I'd like a game that embraces that from day one. Let each PC be the head of their own world bordering on their own game and intermix other players when useful or desired, or occasionally when circumstances dictate.

---

As for who everyone plays, that's up to all of you. If it's an old character, it has to be someone who can plausibly be that level of power. Easy for some, much harder for others. If it's someone who isn't plausible, you'll have to sell me on it. New characters are also fine, though you'll be starting from the ground up and probably be a slower starter on account of it. I'm not even opposed to people grabbing noted NPCs or people from the C&M topic, within reason and subject to DM veto. Feel free to be creative. Who you choose will naturally impact things, so bear that in mind.

Generally, playing deities will either be quasi powers or demi powers (mostly Alicia and Seira here, but I would consider a fresh DvR1 demi power with a good enough set up, since B1 went into how deities are trying to raise more demi powers to help oppose Shar). Choosing this option over a powerful but non divine character will come with some complications to balance it out, since it's a considerable power boost. For example, Alicia and Seira have the whole 'Oh shit stop the end of Creation' quest going on.

---

The game's themes are going to focus around several things. Most of these are things that are touched on in other Balmuria games, but never given a lot of focus for various reasons.

1. Fuck Shar. B3 essentially had a Shar embargo after B2, so she was only mentioned indirectly until the finale. As she's a big deal right now, one aspect of things will be pushing back against her. Most of the multiverse has reasons to be opposed to her right now, even those who might get along with her otherwise. So expect some fighting and hopefully messing up Shar but good.

2. The Competition. While touched on in B1 and mentioned at times in B3, this has never gotten a lot of focus. It will more in this game, be it directly (by deific PCs) or serving powers who involve their direct servants with it (for non deific PCs). You'll be expected to spread the ethos and faith of whomever or whatever you serve or represent, regardless of anything else.

3. The Answer. Touched on a few times occasionally, it's known that the Incarnations sought an answer to law vs chaos, and then good vs evil once those concepts were born in Creation. One could fairly say Creation's reason to exist is to answer those questions, yet so far none have provided the shining answer that could settle any of those disputes forever. While the odds are long that you'll be the one to finally provide one, at least you may be able to take steps towards one. This will go into a lot of information that deities don't spread about Creation, the sort of information you only brushed against in previous games. Which leads into the next one...

4. Answers. A lot of Creation's deepest facts and truths are only referenced, alluded to or simply not talked about. This will be a game that goes into those, as noted above. What ones you go into and learn about will depend on a lot of things, including who you play and how gameplay develops, but at the least, you'll have a chance to answer a lot of mysteries presented throughout Balmuria's run.

5. Bonds. The last and deepest theme I'd like to explore is how each PC develops friends and allies around themselves. With each character having a fairly set cast around themselves, I'll be looking to go deeply in each character ala B1. B1 did the most work into getting into character's heads, something B3 had to skimp on thanks to the large cast of characters.

[Iron Dragoon]

Sounds really interesting to me. I think we may want to come up with a quick reference sheet for everyone who plays regarding what things they regularly deal with. Since it won't be a tight-knit PC party doing everything together, it'll be easier to forget that character so-and-so dealt with thing X, Y, Z since not everyone will be directly involved with X, Y, Z.

While leading a team is a thing, are we talking about all PCs acting out of a single location like Aurora? Because if one character goes under Sylica, they're probably going to want to operate out of somewhere that's closely tied to her vs. someone else operating under Seira and operating out of the Cauldron. Or is it going to be a thing like they have their personal HQ out of wherever and the NPCs are housed out of a central location so they can sorta be assigned to different teams when needed?

As for team members, is this going to be already established NPCs, or can we design our own NPCs/teams if we want?

[Anastasia]

Sounds really interesting to me. I think we may want to come up with a quick reference sheet for everyone who plays regarding what things they regularly deal with. Since it won't be a tight-knit PC party doing everything together, it'll be easier to forget that character so-and-so dealt with thing X, Y, Z since not everyone will be directly involved with X, Y, Z.

Coordination like that would be a good idea to help PCs keep things straight, yes. B3 used a bit of that, I got the impression it was helpful for all of you.

While leading a team is a thing, are we talking about all PCs acting out of a single location like Aurora? Because if one character goes under Sylica, they're probably going to want to operate out of somewhere that's closely tied to her vs. someone else operating under Seira and operating out of the Cauldron. Or is it going to be a thing like they have their personal HQ out of wherever and the NPCs are housed out of a central location so they can sorta be assigned to different teams when needed?

They would not be working out of a single location unless the players designed it that way - like all choosing to play, I don't know, agents of Lathander in the same order.

As for team members, is this going to be already established NPCs, or can we design our own NPCs/teams if we want?

Depends on who is chosen and how. Generally, if you start with a new PC, your early work will be assembling a team. You could end up recruiting someone you know (ala Ebony or Balyss being recruited for B3 from B1), but you'd be doing that work IC once the game starts.

[Iron Dragoon]

If we decide to play our old characters, like I pick Surraruthru back up, would there be any kind of time gap, leveling up, finishing old goals, ect., or would it be just a step right in and go deal?

[Anastasia]

If we decide to play our old characters, like I pick Surraruthru back up, would there be any kind of time gap, leveling up, finishing old goals, ect., or would it be just a step right in and go deal?

It would depend on how things shape up.

I don't want a total B3 rehash, just FYI. I don't mind some being drawn from there - Moore was strongly implied to be moving in that direction for example - but that game just finished. Edit: Honestly, I think it would come down to a request for the generals not to be replayed, since they could bring the whole bulk of Aurora into things. Non generals can't do that and I can manage that a lot better. Edit 2: Huh, I'm arguing against an old character being replayed. Eb, Cor, is today Upside-Down Day for y'all as well?

[Corwin]

Eb, Cor, is today Upside-Down Day for y'all as well?

No  :)

[Anastasia]

Hah.

[Ebiris]

The whole node/interconnectivity thing sounds pretty neat. I'm not really sure how I feel about the themes and metaplot as described. Shar's a bitch to expend brain cells worrying about, and the choice between trying to get back into a character from a decade ago or starting fresh and then not having the advantages of that older character is kinda iffy.

[Anastasia]

The whole node/interconnectivity thing sounds pretty neat.

I wasn't sure if I was up my own ass on that one or not, so I'm glad to see it's getting a good reception. Really, I'd like each PC to be the king or queen of their own little world and connect to others as they see fit.

I'm not really sure how I feel about the themes and metaplot as described. Shar's a bitch to expend brain cells worrying about, and the choice between trying to get back into a character from a decade ago or starting fresh and then not having the advantages of that older character is kinda iffy.

No argument about picking up an old character. If you did go the Alicia route (and/or Cor the Seira one), I'd assume some changes are going to happen. The two have gone through an apotheosis and all the changes in perspective that brings. As divinity settles onto them, some adjustments are inevitable. What the means in practical terms is that 'freshening up' the characters is perfectly acceptable. Adding, subtracting and adjusting is all expected. It's both to help reduce the feeling of missing something and wondering if you're OOC, as well as giving you a chance to spruce the old character up by adding a new wrinkle or two. Consider it a chance to freshen things up however you want, within reason.

As for Shar? Well, I think everyone who has dealt with her can agree she needs a kick in the face. I'm hoping you PCs will be the ones to give it to her, though she won't be the only thing going on. While giving Shar the proverbial middle finger is a factor in the campaign, it's not the only thing going on.

The thing is, I have confidence you could run Alicia again and get a good campaign out of it. Back when B3 was essentially a ghost game with Yuth still playing, I don't think anyone thought we'd see Afina, Jaela or Ithea back in action. But just like that, I think that if we give it a go and put an effort in, we can get to those resolutions B3 got and the good feeling of finishing things and gaining closure. Generally speaking, when this group tries, we usually have a pretty good game.

Now all that being said, starting fresh is an option too. While you don't get the advantages of using an old character, you do get the freedom of a new one. That's a trade off, too. It all depends on if you feel that freedom is desirable and worth it. Sometimes freedom is worth a lot, y'know?

[Nephrite]

If there is still a story to be told about Moore's adventures, I'm all for it.