[Haruhi][Rewrite] Later

[Brian]

Some belated feedback for 4:

After what rest I got -- not quite enough -- I tried thinking about things with Haruhi. Really, I'd been doing that a lot, lately, or trying very hard not to. Making myself try and face the problem head-on was a lot like taking a greenhouse sheltered sapling and then planting it on the slope of a mountain. Not being acclimated to the bitter cold and high winds, the plant breaks or dies back heavily, and takes years to recover from the stunting.

Perhaps remove the comma before "lately"?

Yes, I think so.

Who to blame for that, though?

I think I understand what you wanted to do here, but I kind of want to say "who's" instead.

Changed it to 'Who's fault is that, though?'

That sounds eminently reasonable, to me. Another of those tiny steps.

This comma might (I emphasize might) break the flow.  If you prefer it, I suggest, say, "at least to me".

I'll go with that latter suggestions.

Tsuruya's smile vanishes as she looks up at the sky thoughtfully. "I suppose so.... I didn't know him terribly well. For whatever reason, Mikuru-chan didn't speak about him much. Anyway, would you bring him flowers from me, when you go?"

I think you said you were going to stick with "Mikuru-chan" throughout, but in case you didn't, pointing this out.

Ah ... nope.  That was about Yuki.

There was a comment that Tsuruya should call her 'Mikuru' and 'Mikuru-chan' was a slip, but I decided that I'd let it stay, and Tsuruya's been consistent.

"I'd like to think I'm wrong, too, but forewarned is forearmed."

Is there a saying to this effect in Japanese?  Though really, how can one completely avoid English-language sayings and idioms in a work?  It'd be entirely too constraining, I think.

Man, I started seriously considering that first question. :p

I'll leave it as it is; sometimes I worry the way I write alienates the readership anyway. :x

The picture is typical Koizumi. Older than when I saw him last, but far younger than me, now. He looks perfect as ever in his nice suit. I guess it's from the time he and Haruhi were working together, but there's no date on it, so I can only wonder.... Some part of his smile looks genuine enough that I think that must be it.

Do you like the comma after "far younger than me"?

Not that much, actually.

Nodoka: Akane-chan, you don't think it a bad omen that I gave you and Ranma my katana, do you?  This Zen person thought it was a wonderful idea...

Steal from the best!

She laboriously lowered herself to sit on the edge of the porch, legs dangling over the walkway. "Hey, Kyon-kun," she said, her voice rough. Her eyes closed and she tilted her face up towards the sky. "How is your writings?"

"How is" -> "How are"?

It's her verbal tic pluralizing 'writing.' >.>

Just as I reached the conclusion that I would die there, a familiar voice spoke from somewhere behind my head. I coukld hear it despite the fact that I couldn''t pick out the sounds of Tsuruya's fight with her husband.

There's an extra apostrophe in "couldn't".

Weird.  There's a 'k' in could, too. O_o

"Unpredictable reactions result in more diverse data sets," Ryouko noted.

First-name basis now?  Elsewhere too, though a find-and-replace would fix that if it's a mistake.  If not, I won't point it out further.

Right.  Kyon doesn't call anyone but Haruhi by first name.  (And Kintaro)  :x

Should be Asakura.

Interesting that it would be addressed and signed (if I read the implication correctly) with family name initials.

Yeah, they never got to the first-name basis.

"Troubled?" I ask, wondering what she made of the entire thing. She has been to a funeral with me once before, but neither of us felt much inclined to visit the grave of Tsuruya's husband afterwards.

Ah, so he was officially declared dead?  I hadn't remembered that.

Yeah, after five years of him being gone (which is Japanese law).  It gets mentioned next chapter.

The previous sympathetic view of Koizumi fits much better with this contemplative journey to his grave now, and with Haruhi's note at the grave, it reinforces that Haruhi is in looking for support.  Hence, I think it's all come together a bit better than I remember.

And I am quite pleased with that!

Okay, thanks for those corrections.  I think ... I can get chapter six posted tonight, but seven has actual new scenes (not just revision) so....

...yeah.  Thanks again!  I greatly appreciate your commentary.

[Brian]

Erg, my thread's all disorganized ... I should link the posts with other chapters from the first one.

Okay.  This is the shakiest chapter yet, though the reasons may not be visible to all readers until I post the next one. :/

I'm trying to foreshadow something without being too blatant, and ... erg.  Well.

Next chapter's going to be the make-or-break, I expect.  So!  Here it is, with one more chapter and the epilogue to follow.

[sarsaparilla]

Chapter 6:

Spoiler: ShowHide

So, she's not necessarily so mature after all...

"Well, that's certainly a mark to leave on the world, Haruhi,"

I don't even know why, but this remark made me feel bad (I'm certainly biased because I'm watching the scene through Haruhi's eyes). It looks innocent enough on the surface but there's something in it that hits quite hard on the emotional level. Too flippant? Too much ironic echo? I'm not sure whether it's just me reading too much into it, or if it's even intentional. Maybe I'm just reading it with the wrong tone of voice in my mind?

"Believe me, more than anything, I'd want to find him and tell him....  If I could -- I would be telling him about this right now!"

Ha! :P

This, combined with what is being told about the mystery poet (especially that he wasn't even invited to the party) may make the issue too obvious, although I must admit that 'obvious' is one of those concepts that I'm permanently unable to reconcile with what other people claim it to mean in any given case.

"'Me: One of two finalists in a poetry competition at a secret island gathering.  You: A party-crasher and the other finalist.  Also: I'm pregnant, call me'!"

Again, surprisingly flippant from Kyon at this point. Haruhi is in a terrible position, probably the worst she's ever found herself in, and hurting because of it.

On the whole, a lot depends on how the next chapter rolls out, but based on what I've seen so far...

Haruhi sounds perhaps a bit too broken. Although it's clear that she doesn't have a leg to stand on (which must be a new and frightening experience for a person who is used to the world bending around her wishes), I would've kind of expected her to try to find at least some cards to play instead of just admitting that she's got an empty hand.

Her rationales, especially concerning the major decisions, are in character but remain somewhat sketchy. I felt that it might be possible to substantiate them a bit more.

Haruhi's suggestion that she'd basically dump the baby on Kyon is probably the most problematic part of the chapter, at least in the way it comes out right now. While the premise fits in and leads to the confrontation with Tsuruya (which works), it feels like there's something missing. Considering how much more reflective and considerate Haruhi is otherwise, just dropping the idea in a straightforward manner makes Haruhi's motives all the way from the beginning of the story more questionable than you may intend. At this point she certainly must be aware of the fact that she can't be on the receiving end only, and I would've expected to see her try (even desperately) to figure out something to give back in compensation. In other words, trying to find something to bargain with instead of simply begging (and the 'covering expenses' part doesn't count).

For all I know she might have done that already without success, but it doesn't show through. She could at least admit that she is aware of the issue, that she doesn't know how to handle it, and that if Kyon has any ideas she would be willing to consider them. She doesn't have to actually do anything, just show that she's taking the issue into consideration, to avoid the complete humiliation of being reduced to plain begging.

So, this story is being wrapped up? *sigh* It's one of those rare ones where you hope that it would never end ... but I can see the logistic problems in that!

[Brian]

Spoiler: ShowHide

So, she's not necessarily so mature after all...

I couldn't let her be perfect ... though, this would probably be a much happier story if I did. >.>

"Well, that's certainly a mark to leave on the world, Haruhi,"

I don't even know why, but this remark made me feel bad (I'm certainly biased because I'm watching the scene through Haruhi's eyes). It looks innocent enough on the surface but there's something in it that hits quite hard on the emotional level. Too flippant? Too much ironic echo? I'm not sure whether it's just me reading too much into it, or if it's even intentional. Maybe I'm just reading it with the wrong tone of voice in my mind?

Hmm.  I can see how this would come across as flippant.

I'll get back to this in a tic.

"Believe me, more than anything, I'd want to find him and tell him....  If I could -- I would be telling him about this right now!"

Ha! :P

This, combined with what is being told about the mystery poet (especially that he wasn't even invited to the party) may make the issue too obvious, although I must admit that 'obvious' is one of those concepts that I'm permanently unable to reconcile with what other people claim it to mean in any given case.

Well, either you are particularly perceptive, or the majority of people who read my story just aren't as able to pick up the clues as you are. :)

I'm actually quite pleased you caught those implications; the inability of the Henry Cobbs of the world to get what I was trying to do with this story depressed me enough that I pulled it down during the first re-write attempt (shamefully, this is the second re-write, but perhaps the third write will be the charm!)  That and the fact that even though I have implied what you've picked up, I've (mostly) managed to avoid stating it.  >.>'

Others may find it less obvious, but I'm pretty satisfied with where it is; I want people to figure it out, and I don't want to have to spell it out and make it obvious (before the epilogue).

"'Me: One of two finalists in a poetry competition at a secret island gathering.  You: A party-crasher and the other finalist.  Also: I'm pregnant, call me'!"

Again, surprisingly flippant from Kyon at this point. Haruhi is in a terrible position, probably the worst she's ever found herself in, and hurting because of it.

That's not Kyon, that's Haruhi. >.>;;

So, um....  Hmm.  There was no speech indicator, but there's a somewhat obscure little grammatical thing involving quotation and paragraphs.  It involves the trailing quotation being removed.  For example:

"This is normal dialog," Alice remarked.

"And this is going to be a longer reply," Bob returned, "to provide relevant example text.  Admittedly, the content of this dialog is irrelevant.

"Even if it is irrelevant, however, it provides a good example of grammatical punctuation, especially with a line separated out for emphasis and impact!"

Alice sighed, opining, "This is a fairly obscure technique."

So, in the above example, even though the third line should seem to be belonging to Alice, the lack of a closing quotation in paragraph two indicates that Bob's speech carries over.

And once again I suspect after I've pointed that out, you actually already knew.

Back to the point: For the first moment when Kyon is flippant, I think to a small degree that would be okay -- he is stunned.  But I don't want his reaction to be something that could come across as genuinely hurtful; he's shocked, not indifferent.  I'll try and think of what I can do to tone that one down.

For the second moment, since it's Haruhi, trying to add some levity herself, does that work?

On the whole, a lot depends on how the next chapter rolls out, but based on what I've seen so far...

Haruhi sounds perhaps a bit too broken. Although it's clear that she doesn't have a leg to stand on (which must be a new and frightening experience for a person who is used to the world bending around her wishes), I would've kind of expected her to try to find at least some cards to play instead of just admitting that she's got an empty hand.

Her rationales, especially concerning the major decisions, are in character but remain somewhat sketchy. I felt that it might be possible to substantiate them a bit more.

Haruhi's suggestion that she'd basically dump the baby on Kyon is probably the most problematic part of the chapter, at least in the way it comes out right now. While the premise fits in and leads to the confrontation with Tsuruya (which works), it feels like there's something missing. Considering how much more reflective and considerate Haruhi is otherwise, just dropping the idea in a straightforward manner makes Haruhi's motives all the way from the beginning of the story more questionable than you may intend. At this point she certainly must be aware of the fact that she can't be on the receiving end only, and I would've expected to see her try (even desperately) to figure out something to give back in compensation. In other words, trying to find something to bargain with instead of simply begging (and the 'covering expenses' part doesn't count).

For all I know she might have done that already without success, but it doesn't show through. She could at least admit that she is aware of the issue, that she doesn't know how to handle it, and that if Kyon has any ideas she would be willing to consider them. She doesn't have to actually do anything, just show that she's taking the issue into consideration, to avoid the complete humiliation of being reduced to plain begging.

I ... have to admit that humiliation didn't even occur to me from any point between writing this story and now, where you just pointed it out.  It doesn't mean it's not there; I unconsciously/subconsciously seem to do things like this constantly. >_<

Hmm.  I think in previous drafts, this was somewhat offset by Koizumi's betrayal?  No, probably it was still a very weak point even then.

I need to think about this one a bit.  I think you make a strong point that Haruhi should at least try to bring something else to the table, but I'm kind of stumped for 'what'.  I mean ... as Haruhi (in this story) stands, she really doesn't have much to offer a child (especially in her mind).  Hence Kyon's remark about 'if you believe you can't do it...'.

I think she offers good reasons for why she feels she can't handle it, and she explains some of the reason she doesn't think she can be involved....  But as you note, the damage runs deep at this point.  While I'd like to be able to give her something more, another part of it is, she only even found Kyon (in the very beginning) because she felt she was running out of options; she actually was going to beg Tsuruya for help, but Kyon appeared to be a much better option.

Hmm.  That seems possibly incredibly selfish (as Tsuruya complains).  The thing of it is, it's _meant_ to be sympathetic, that Haruhi's trying to arrange for the best for her child because she doesn't believe she can do it herself, so....

There's another reason I want to avoid Haruhi promising to do things after the baby's born, but that's all spoiler territory.  I think ... considering how things go....

No, offering to be Kyon's publicist wouldn't really cut it.  Or maybe it would?  It'd be reiterating the closing note of the chapter (so maybe I could just drop it from there), but Kyon would probably agree to anything that meant Haruhi would stay nearby, as he'd feel that was a chance to get Haruhi to bond with the child....  Alright.  I don't think it's a great idea on my part, but I can't think of a better way to address that concern.

Unless you or someone else has a better suggestion. >_>;;

Ech, this also prompts more of a rewrite of the next chapter. >_<

So, this story is being wrapped up? *sigh* It's one of those rare ones where you hope that it would never end ... but I can see the logistic problems in that!

I think I read somewhere that the goal of writing is 'always leave them wanting more.'

Hopefully I can keep the ending from being an abysmal failure, like it's been the last two attempts at this. ^_^;;

And so, as always, thank you very much for the feedback. :D

[sarsaparilla]

And a reply to that:

Spoiler: ShowHide

That's not Kyon, that's Haruhi.

Ah, mea culpa, misread that part. Self-deprecation is fine.

That seems possibly incredibly selfish (as Tsuruya complains).  The thing of it is, it's _meant_ to be sympathetic, that Haruhi's trying to arrange for the best for her child because she doesn't believe she can do it herself, so....

I think that it all depends on how Haruhi expresses the idea, or even more, what is her own disposition in relation to it. The potential for both sympathetic and selfish is there, and it may be a fine line to tread to stay in the first domain instead of the second.

There's another reason I want to avoid Haruhi promising to do things after the baby's born, but that's all spoiler territory.  I think ... considering how things go....

This comment, in combination with the remaining length of the story, actually frightens me ... I'm hoping very hard to not see any of the darker possibilities (which I haven't mentioned, see no evil ... right?) that have crossed my mind while reading this story.

No, offering to be Kyon's publicist wouldn't really cut it.

No, absolutely not. That would be worse than not offering anything, and would potentially suggest that Haruhi thinks that she can just buy herself out of the bind. It can't be anything that tangible.

Unless you or someone else has a better suggestion.

I believe that with proper handling the issue can be contained within this chapter without a need to propagate consequences to the next one, especially because the main consequence is exposed already here. However, in order to be able to give any further opinion, I think that I must know the rest of the story first. Therefore, if you still want my input on the issue I suggest that it could be put on the side until later, and solved separately once the time is ready for that.

I feel honored to be able to help with a story of this magnitude!

[Brian]

And a reply to that:

And thanks again. ^_^;;

Spoiler: ShowHide

I think that it all depends on how Haruhi expresses the idea, or even more, what is her own disposition in relation to it. The potential for both sympathetic and selfish is there, and it may be a fine line to tread to stay in the first domain instead of the second.

So, more depressed over her belief that she can't do it, less pleased that she's found someone who can.  A sort of bittersweet satisfaction that (she thinks) she's found a resolution, even though she can't be part of it.

Okay.  Yeah, that works, though it does stress the fact that Haruhi's got unresolved issues.  Actually ... more emphasis there is probably better, unfortunately, considering how well the other bits seemed foreshadowed in comparison.

This comment, in combination with the remaining length of the story, actually frightens me ... I'm hoping very hard to not see any of the darker possibilities (which I haven't mentioned, see no evil ... right?) that have crossed my mind while reading this story.

I feel bad about this....  Apologies, but I'd rather have you frightened now than angry at me for delivering the ending so badly later. >_<

I'm incredibly nervous about improperly set expectations with this one.  >_>;;

I did say the ending was the part of this story's that the most ... ridden with issues.  Hopefully, with the commentary you and Muphrid have been providing (and Hal, in IRC) I'll be able to make it work.  I feel that the story so far is already vastly improved thanks to your input.  ^_^;;

But I also hope it doesn't upset or offend you, and if it does, I know that it's quite flawed and am trying to fix it, so will be very open-minded when it comes to suggestions to fix it.  I want to write something that's uplifting, even if it doesn't work out in the expected way ... which could be a big part of the problem.  It may be that the ending I wanted just won't work, and I'll need to settle for something more acceptable.  :x

No, absolutely not. That would be worse than not offering anything, and would potentially suggest that Haruhi thinks that she can just buy herself out of the bind. It can't be anything that tangible.

It's better than her previous offer of money, but not by much, yeah. :(

I believe that with proper handling the issue can be contained within this chapter without a need to propagate consequences to the next one, especially because the main consequence is exposed already here. However, in order to be able to give any further opinion, I think that I must know the rest of the story first. Therefore, if you still want my input on the issue I suggest that it could be put on the side until later, and solved separately once the time is ready for that.

I feel honored to be able to help with a story of this magnitude!

Ah, you flatter me. :p

Okay.  Rather than trying to be clever and make it perfect right off the bat(something that's not happened with this story anyway so far), I'll move forward with what I have of the final chapter and the epilogue, but I suspect they'll need heavy revision.

Haha, the anxiety of getting this wrong after your praise so far is a remarkably heavy burden, but nothing compared to the confidence instilled thanks to recieving your critical commentary.  I'm immensely grateful for your help in improving this story.  ^_^;

[Muphrid]

Regarding chapter 5:

I think about this for a minute. "I'm not about to leap into anything without thinking about what I'm doing very carefully, at this age," I warn the pair of them. Nagato immediately begins to break into her amused 'triumphant' expression, and Tsuruya catches it too, her grin widening.

It seems to me like the contemplation here is pronounced in real time but short on the page, making it feel like he doesn't really think about it at all.  Then again, that may be the intended impression.

"Okay!" Tsuruya says cheerfully. "Then enough of this gloomy sulking! I like a bright, happy, home, and cheerful friends!"

Kill the comma after "happy"?

And to be honest, I had much bigger concerns around then.... "I would guess ... around the time Kin-chan was born I realized that it might have been an issue, but the way my life was going...." I shrug again. "Well ... then I somewhat became stuck. I have Nagato, who is like a sister to me, and Kin-chan, who is like family, too-- And I'm not on good terms with my own family. That's not a good basis to approach a woman, is it?"

Quoting this not so much by itself but because everything around it seems the same:  there are a lot of ellipses running around.  Almost always in places where their use is justified, but even so, there's a good number of them.

"I really do wish I had more I could tell you," I apologize, rubbing at my temples. "Ah, when you finish your tea, we should head out to meet Kintaro."

Something that might sit in the back of Kyon's mind--while it's a necessary lie, and not even for the same reasons as back in school, he's deceiving Haruhi again.  It was deception that partially motivated fleeing from her.  He had reasons to fear what would happen if he failed that he couldn't share or use to dissuade her.  While I don't think Kyon would do differently now, I do think he could recognize what's happening and feel some discomfort in doing so.


I fear I may have rushed this a little bit, trying to get caught up so I can give more timely feedback when the big revision of the ending comes.  I do think that, while this is probably nothing that should be seriously restructured, a good bit of this chapter seems to be spent in contemplation as Kyon goes about his duties.  This is by no means uninteresting--the level of detail is really quite staggering--but it seems to connect only distantly to the big picture.  The tanuki are dealt with.  We see Kyon caring for Tsuruya's husband's portrait.  That's...about all that strikes me without looking back and picking it apart.  The greater significance of these acts--if, say, they're helping Kyon return to normalcy or recenter himself after Haruhi's reentrance into his life has given him so much to ponder--seems to have lost me, I'm afraid.  I have the nagging feeling that I know that meaning is there but that I'd need to read a good bit closer to make sure I see it, if that makes sense.

...or, I see sarsaparilla said more or less the same thing.  At any rate, I hope this is of aid and to get to chapter six and fully up to speed as soon as possible.

[Brian]

Regarding chapter 5:

I think about this for a minute. "I'm not about to leap into anything without thinking about what I'm doing very carefully, at this age," I warn the pair of them. Nagato immediately begins to break into her amused 'triumphant' expression, and Tsuruya catches it too, her grin widening.

It seems to me like the contemplation here is pronounced in real time but short on the page, making it feel like he doesn't really think about it at all.  Then again, that may be the intended impression.

Hmm.  Not ... entirely.

Okay, I'll rework that -- he doesn't really need to think about it much at that point considering how much he's _been_ thinking about it. <_<;

Kill the comma after "happy"?

Will do!

Quoting this not so much by itself but because everything around it seems the same:  there are a lot of ellipses running around.  Almost always in places where their use is justified, but even so, there's a good number of them.

My abuse of ellipses is particularly famous, yes. :x

I'll try and clear out at least half of those.

"I really do wish I had more I could tell you," I apologize, rubbing at my temples. "Ah, when you finish your tea, we should head out to meet Kintaro."

Something that might sit in the back of Kyon's mind--while it's a necessary lie, and not even for the same reasons as back in school, he's deceiving Haruhi again.  It was deception that partially motivated fleeing from her.  He had reasons to fear what would happen if he failed that he couldn't share or use to dissuade her.  While I don't think Kyon would do differently now, I do think he could recognize what's happening and feel some discomfort in doing so.

This is touched on a bit later, but it could use more attention here, so alright.

I fear I may have rushed this a little bit, trying to get caught up so I can give more timely feedback when the big revision of the ending comes.  I do think that, while this is probably nothing that should be seriously restructured, a good bit of this chapter seems to be spent in contemplation as Kyon goes about his duties.  This is by no means uninteresting--the level of detail is really quite staggering--but it seems to connect only distantly to the big picture.  The tanuki are dealt with.  We see Kyon caring for Tsuruya's husband's portrait.  That's...about all that strikes me without looking back and picking it apart.  The greater significance of these acts--if, say, they're helping Kyon return to normalcy or recenter himself after Haruhi's reentrance into his life has given him so much to ponder--seems to have lost me, I'm afraid.  I have the nagging feeling that I know that meaning is there but that I'd need to read a good bit closer to make sure I see it, if that makes sense.

...or, I see sarsaparilla said more or less the same thing.  At any rate, I hope this is of aid and to get to chapter six and fully up to speed as soon as possible.

The main significance is the number of tanuki, and the behavior of the 'father' and 'mother' among them....

Mph.  One of those bits that's ... too dull, I guess.  I'm not really sure what to do about this, but I actually like most of that scene anyway.  It serves as something for the epilogue to call back to, and is significant for *spoiler*, but generally, isn't really critical.

I'll probably let it go just because I like it, here, and try to emphasise the 'return to normalcy' aspect, and that Kyon is adjusting.  Hopefully I can make that plausible.  :X

Anyway.  Don't rush yourself; it's looking a lot like I'm going to end up rewriting much of chapter 6/7 the epilogue as it stands from what I end up posting anyway.

Okay, thanks for the feedback.  I'll try and get some revising done tonight, but I seem to be building quite the backlog. ^_^;;

[Muphrid]

Regarding, for instance, the tanuki:  tor the purposes of return to normalcy, it does work.  Now that you mention it, I do faintly remember that that was referenced later on, and hey, I'm a big fan of that--seemingly innocuous passages that acquire greater significance in hindsight.  In that sense of things, I wouldn't alter the substance, maybe only the presentation.  Kyon's not one to talk much of his feelings, but if, say, he related how these tasks are helping him digest and process or, oppositely, if they're helping him get away for a bit, I think that would put the passage as a whole into clearer focus.

[Brian]

Okay.  I've done that.

And otherwise slightly touched up chapters 5-8.  Here's chapter seven and the epilogue; this is the extended chapter 7, which ... felt like it solved a lot of the issues I'd been running into, actually.  I feel strangely confident about this revision, and am surprised at how minor (so far) it's ended up being.

That probably means it's exceptionally terrible, but I'll be hopeful anyway.

I'm still prepared for massive revisions, should they be needed. <_<

[Muphrid]

I still want to do a line-by-line, but let me give some general comments regarding the ending:

Spoiler: ShowHide

Truth be told, the ending to this story is still a bit baffling to me.  There's a good bit of it I feel I get on an intellectual level--the talk of second chances, of karma built up between lives.  Asakura being the one to go to Kyon in his last moments surprised me; I didn't remember that particular detail.  Even so, I have to say that this ending doesn't sit wholly well with me.  I think too much sits in the level of subtext for it to give a real sense of conclusion and closure.  Kyon and Haruhi are given a second chance at living their lives together (...goodness, if I even remember that correctly from before, or am parsing it correctly now).  Kyon doesn't even really have a choice in the matter (yikes!), nor are we given immediate reason to think he'd want to, fridge considerations notwithstanding.

What I see is a great possibility, mind you.  I see that, over the course of Megumi growing up, Kyon would recognize and affirm what he saw in her eyes as a baby--that this child is what, Haruhi reincarnated?  He would glimpse some of the things that made Haruhi so unique and feel that those memories are nostalgic and bittersweet.  And as his body fails him, he's given a compassionate offer by Asakura--the chance to live his life over with Haruhi because it will make him happy, because he makes Nagato happy.  That's something Kyon would consider very carefully, probably rejecting it at first, and maybe we don't even see his decision until Megumi takes over the narrative, meeting the new Kyon in the sand garden.

All that above...is probably not what you should do.  This is only my way of giving substance to a feeling that is otherwise very hard to pin down.  Make no mistake--I enjoyed this story very much back in February and I've enjoyed it again now.  Given understanding, I can appreciate the ending and what it set out to do (criticism that would ignore that would be questions about how Haruhi could die, what about her powers--actually Kyon's remark about having no deceptions anymore, in reference to Megumi's father, does a great deal to signify his change in attitude).  All that stuff is somewhat beyond point--I don't think that's stuff you could change without having a very different message and approach.  I do think that the ending as written makes it very tough to ferret out the "answer" of what happened in a satisfactory way.

Maybe the short way to put it is best.  Whatever emotional fulfillment Kyon and Haruhi might receive from this second chance is just lost because neither of them remember, nor do either of them have the ability to make it a deliberate choice or savor the possibility.

Maybe that's not it, either.

As I said, I hope to do line-by-line on 6-end over the next few days.  I don't know if this is the sort of thing that would spur on a major revision or not, though; hence, I thought it best to give what I could now and let the chips fall where they may.

[Brian]

Hum.

Spoiler: ShowHide

That bit about choice (between Yuki and Mikuru) was poorly planned on my part.

I'll probably strike it out and figure out something better for that part.  For the rest, I thought about this for a bit and had an idea that ... might address that.  And it might not.  Anyway:

I was thinking that the Mikuru scene could be revised so that Kyon asked a question or two that he thought he should before Mikuru asks her own question.  That'd be a good place for him to explore his regret on keeping secrets again -- contrasting the fact that he can be completely honest with Mikuru (who just messed with him without asking or explaining anything), just like he can't with Haruhi (who has been much more open and straightforward).

The only other thing that it occured to me to add would be possibly Kyon resolving to tell Haruhi everything after the baby's born, but that seems too bitter. >_<

Ultimately, it may not be possible to present the whole 'do over a second time around without any of the baggage' concept the way I tried.

Maybe the better ending is

Spoiler: ShowHide

Haruhi ignoring the bonsai analogy and sticking around anyway.

[Muphrid]

Well, in fairness, it may be best to see what sarsa has to say about the ending, since he picked up on several hints in the story that I don't think I quite followed on the first read through.

[Brian]

Alrighty, then.  It seems that this is in a holding pattern for a bit.  Back to K:BDH!

[sarsaparilla]

About the last part (and indirectly about the entire story), then. I don't dare to call it criticism at this stage, I'm just trying to express my point of view.

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First, I must declare my personal bias. I don't believe nor disbelieve in reincarnation, for me it's something completely irrelevant in the same way as the knowledge that the atoms that constitute my current body have belonged to other people, other beings and non-beings in the past. None of those past entities are me, this unique combination of traits and memories, and when I cease to exist everything I ever was will be permanently gone and nobody will remember nor care. This is what I sincerely believe (I'm not an atheist, nihilist or any of those things, just an apathetic not-worthy-ist).

Furthermore, out of the characters in the story I most strongly identify with Haruhi, and that also colors my interpretation.

So, when Kyon cuts the bonsai, the symbolic message I get is "Haruhi, you are the most damaged branch that must be cut out and thrown away so that you don't hinder the growth of other branches". The omnipotent entity that I see more as an abomination and a curse than a blessing and which is directly responsible for making such a mess out of Haruhi's life then complies and kills her. Regardless of what Megumi is, Haruhi is dead, her experiences are gone and she perishes in deceit, without gaining any insight on what brought her down, without receiving any closure, not even learning who the father of her child is ... especially this last point, the mere thought still makes me cry every time....

I can see the point of the story, and that the above is not the intended interpretation, but it still utterly trashes me on the emotional level.

That said, I must admit that I am completely baffled. Until the penultimate chapter (excluding the Epilogue) I thought that I had a rough understanding on what is going on, but the last chapter made me drop that pretense. I should probably start by enumerating things that I think I got:

• Kintaro is Kyon's and Tsuruya's son, and a reincarnation of Koizumi.
• Megumi is Kyon's and Haruhi's daughter and a reincarnation of Haruhi.
• Kinnosuke is a reincarnation of Kyon brought from another time by Asahina (big).
• Megumi and Kinnosuke will eventually become a couple.

Depending on how exactly one defines reincarnation here, I'm afraid that the situation may turn into squick for me, with wife husbandry being among the least worrisome options.

The list of things I don't understand is much longer (this is not meant as a rant, I'm genuinely puzzled to the extent that I'm not even sure what are the relevant questions). First some minor questions:

• Was the Organization disbanded after Koizumi's death, did Haruhi wish it away, or did it just become irrelevant?
• What is the agenda of Asahina / the future faction in all of this? Specifically, why did Asahina (small) leave so suddenly back then? Why doesn't she, or her older self, provide any explanations, and seem to actively force Kyon's hand on some issues? What is the point of bringing up the resentful poem?
• What is the ultimate agenda of IDSE? Did they indeed cause this whole scenario through delivering a particular piece of information to Koizumi, and if so, why? Will they keep meddling with humans, as they are still present long after Haruhi is gone?

And then some pretty major ones:

• Did Haruhi's powers transfer over to Megumi, or do they otherwise keep interfering with events beyond Haruhi's death? Did the powers foresee the eventual meeting of Megumi and Kinnosuke, or indeed, made it happen? If so, isn't the root cause that doomed Kyon's and Haruhi's relationship still present? If not, isn't Haruhi's 'second chance' a leap of faith into darkness without even a hope to ever see whether something good eventually comes out of it?
• Why does Kyon keep up the masquerade all the way to the end, effectively forcing the eventual outcome? What would happen if he broke it? Apparently, Kyon doesn't even tell Megumi the truth about herself and her mother, thus propagating the deceit right into the next generation. Doesn't this undermine the decision that seals Haruhi's fate if it's Kyon who cannot tell the truth, especially since the old factions are still around and they know about things?
• Who are the girl and boy that Kyon bumps into on his way home? Megumi and Kinnosuke brought back in time by Asahina, Haruhi, or Megumi herself? And if so, why? None of the options that I can think of explains their behavior during the encounter.
• From which time was Kinnosuke pulled from? Who are his parents? Did they consent to their son being taken away? Did Kinnosuke consent to being permanently abducted and mind-wiped (apparently not, Asahina only refers to the promise he made to Kyon)? Did anybody ask Megumi's opinion on the whole thing before arranging it? (The idea of other people deciding such things on one's behalf squicks me badly. I would personally be pushed past the snapping point if I was forcibly introduced to somebody else with the intention of getting into any kind of relationship.)
• How did Asahina find Kyon's reincarnation, that wouldn't seem to be within the capabilities of the future faction? Doesn't the whole premise violate the first tenet of time travel as given in the books, the one that mandates that Asahina must return to her own time because she doesn't belong to Kyon's time frame?

Thus, at the moment I don't genuinely know what to make out of the story, as some of the most fundamental rationales and connections stay out of my reach.